Time for a new thread. For the want of anything better to hang it off, I hereby reprint my piece in Crikey last week on prospects for the Senate. This does not mean discussion on this thread need be relevant to this topic.
Like so much else this year, speculation about the Senate election has been guided by “the narrowing”: that mystical force that would drive swinging voters to the Coalition once the campaign focused minds on economic management. It’s now clear to all but a dwindling band of die-hards that this hasn’t happened and isn’t about to.
It is thus necessary to revise the view that the Coalition will be strong enough in the Senate to make life difficult for an incoming Rudd Government. The Liberals and Nationals instead find themselves in danger of losing a swag of seats, which opens up a dizzying range of possibilities for the Greens.
A case in point is Kerry Nettle’s bid for re-election in New South Wales. Earlier in the year it seemed safe to assume there would be a traditional three-all split between left and right, with Nettle fighting a probably losing battle with Labor’s number three, Senator Ursula Stephens. In that context, any improvement in the Labor vote would have been damaging for Nettle. Now it seems Labor might be strong enough to win Stephens a seat without excluding Nettle, perhaps even bequeathing her a measurable surplus as preferences. That would boost Nettle’s chances of overtaking and defeating the Coalition’s third candidate, Senator Marise Payne.
The story is similar in Victoria, given that Labor and the Democrats have thought better of repeating their 2004 preference exchanges with Family First (who nonetheless have a vague chance if they can match their vote at the state election).
There has been a further stroke of good fortune for the Greens with the entry of independent Nick Xenophon in South Australia. Such is Xenophon’s popularity that he looks likely not only to win a quota in his own right, but also to deliver the Greens a substantial surplus. This could help their candidate Sarah Hanson-Young overcome the third Labor candidate, Cathy Perry.
Bob Brown should have no trouble winning a seat in Tasmania, the question being how the remaining five seats will divide between Labor and Liberal. There is familiar talk that Brown might do well enough to also carry running mate Andrew Wilkie over the line, but this at least seems a little too optimistic.
The two states where Labor’s strength does not help the Greens are Western Australia and Queensland. Western Australia does not look likely to produce the huge swing required to cost the Liberals a third seat, so a strong hike in the Labor vote has the potential to squeeze out the Greens. Nonetheless, their candidate Scott Ludlam remains the firm favourite.
Labor is also becoming hopeful of winning a third seat in Queensland, which it has never done before at a six-seat half-Senate election. On the other side of the ledger, there is a chance that the Coalition will lose the seat of Nationals Senator Ron Boswell to Family First, who will harness the entire right-of-centre vote if they get ahead of Pauline Hanson. It’s hard to see how Hanson herself could put a quota together, despite all that has been written about her minor successes in preference negotiations.
The remaining wild card is the Australian Capital Territory, where Greens candidate Kerrie Tucker threatens an historic win at the expense of Liberal incumbent Gary Humphries. This would be especially significant because territory Senators’ terms are tied to the House of Representatives, so that an end to the Coalition’s absolute majority would take effect immediately.
While it is likely that not all of these potential Greens wins will come off, they will probably have around five Senators joining the two continuing from the 2004 election, to be joined on the cross benches by Nick Xenophon and continuing Family First Senator Steve Fielding. The Coalition will be reduced from its current majority of 39 seats out of 76 to around 35, while Labor should increase its current 28 seats by four.
1,322 Comments
Election 2007 Play List (In no particular order)
Express yourself, Eric B and Rakim
Another one bites the dust, Queen
The final countdown, Europe
Wont get fooled again, The Who
Blue sky mine, Midnight Oil
Should I stay or should I go, The Clash
Changes, David Bowie
Gone daddy gone, Violent Femes
One angry dwarf and 200 solemn faces, Ben Folds Five
Power in a union, Billy Bragg
Killing in the name, Rage Against the Machine
Bottom Line, Big Audio Dynamite
From little things big things grow, Paul Kelly
Beautiful day, U2
Am I ever gonna see your face again, The Angels (including the extra lyrics)
And finally….
Non, je ne regrette rien, The immortal Edith Piaf
For all the Greens talk about how big and bad Labor is, could the irony be that Labor ends up delivering the Greens a meaningful parliamentary presence?
cityblue it works both ways
Costello made an announcement today saying that Labor’s policy costing would not be available until at least Friday if at all – due to Kevin Rudd being a sneak.
But this was overshadowed by the “ineligable 13″ story revealed by Robb at the same press conference.
Are the Libs really trying to win this election at all?
Please, no more “yay me first” type comments.
NB…
I rather like Alan Parsons..
eye in the sky
turn of a friendly card
Or if you like an excuse to annoy the neighbors..
Frida – theres something going on. (on repeat)
Hey William. just some friendly advice from someone who runs a number of bandwidth-hungry servers in both Oz and the US
I don’t know how much control you have over the way your blog works, but I think it would be a good idea to remove the “Show All” link you have in each thread as it mean a ridiculous amount of traffic every time some moron refreshes the page (if they are in that view).
For example, your Galaxy: 52-48 in “marginals” thread, expanded to show all 10 pages, is a whopping 600K+ in size – imagine that page being refreshed several times, by several people, over and over…
Just a thought….
You shameless cheat NB! Repeating your previous post – tisk tisk.
cityblue what if green prefs get labor over the line in bennelong, nth sydney, and wentworth? will you be chuffed or what?
cityblue: ALP winning many lower house seats will be largely assisted by the greens.
Its a win win for both.
Not sure I know how to do that George, but I’ll look into it. Would anyone know how to tinker with my paged comments plugin so it doesn’t take you back to page one when you submit a comment?
You’ll notice William that I wasn’t expecting to be first – I was just wondering what it would be like.
Ineligibility debacle leading on 5pm ABC news
Kevin Rudd brands Peter Costello a ‘right wing radical’ (news radio). Um.. so er.. whats new?
I doubt they expect the ALP to pick up second ACt senate spot. It looks like they just did a google search and listed anyone who’s name hadn’t been take off governmental websites, pretty weak.
Jude,
I’m egotistical to think that it’s actually a nice theme, although others are free to disagree. So I repeated it because I didn’t want it to get lost at the end of the last thread. Again, sorry William I know we’re eating your bandwidth.
The only reason the Libs pulled this stunt was to get Downer and the AWB affair off the front bench.
Dirty dirty politics.
what about cricket?, should customise a cricket ball with bushy eyebrows.
front bench = front page
The problem for the Libs is that most people have no idea how our electoral system works. So saying a candidate is ineligible will mean jack squat to these people. Too technical and as boring as all get out. You might as well rabbit on about party factions for all the good it does.
ABC radio BrisVegas.
All ALP candidates have resigned positions and they are all proper.
21 – That will make Robb look a goose.
More unsolicited advice from Alexander. I suppose in his next life he could write a book of etiquette:
http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,22790661-12377,00.html
William I was wondering that myself – going back to page 1 gives me the shits but i thought it was me and my slow machine
I think a bit of silliness and light heartedness is a good thing on a blog like this.
Gary @20
People are so p#issed off with elections that the prospect of a by-election, no matter how fanciful, could make them vote for candidte who will stay his/her term.
21 hope that is correct. If so, I’m upping my prediction to 90, and pleading with Gillard to say, “Right enough of playing nice f***knuckes, lets spell out some ome truths…
Has anyone done the latest GG/Online Opinion poll? Someone in there must have a sense of humour, one of the questions asks you to describe what kind of dog both Howard and Rudd would be if they were dogs, and why….
25 Mad Cow I think thats what makes this site work – I dont comment much though – I like to watch
ruawake, got a link?
Like many Libs, he actually doesn’t require any external assistance for that.
#21
When is this going to hit the front pages of news ltd? Rudd needs to get all over this NOW (any ALP staffers reading please get the campaign team onto it).
cb, it wouldn’t surprise me if William is a bit short on sleep at this moment. Makes me nervous to comment on the blog itself (duck).
I think the worst case for the Libs with this stunt is that it becomes their Ralph Willis moment.
Sorry I will be off-topic but everytime a post is placed on this blog it gets 100 responses within a minute. So I’ll try to be one of the first.
Let’s first introduce myself. I migrated from Italy, joined the Australian Labor Party in 1982 and did not renew my membership in 2005. This was a combination of my anger that Labor did not counteract Howard on the Tampa in 2001, my disinchantment with Australia generally after the above mentioned Tampa, 9/11 etc and the associated islamophobia etc. and the fact that I had a young family and I did not have the time to devote to political activities.
I still remained an ALP voter. I guess my political beliefs would be closer to the Greens but I somewhat got a bit annoyed at they holier-than-thou attitude.
I will be voting ALP for the House of Representatives and Green for the Senate. Living in one of the safest Labor seats in the country (Batman) it doesn’t really matter.
However, I am not an Howard hater. I think that he really believes that his actions are the best for Australia. I believe that on that account he is genuine, and in a sense this is what it makes it so sad that when we were on a path of becoming a forward looking country, he dragged us back by limiting our horizons – and many Australians agreed with him.
I am also alarmed by the chortling and gloating that many contributors have done here over the past few months based on the polls.
I fear that if Howard wins on Saturday (which is still a possibility) many of you will be so shattered after believing so firmly for such a long time that Howard would be tossed out. I hope you can take it on the chin. It will be really disappointing but life goes on. There are things beside politics.
Australia has a fantastic environment. Just its skies are beautiful. Should the result not go our way. Just wake up on Sunday. Avoid all media (especially The Australian!) and look upwards and take a big breath.
It still nice living here.
26 Chris – I’m not convinced they would change their vote for that reason. I have no evidence one way or the other, but I’m not convinced of that argument.
William, have you considered setting up an IRC channel somewhere for election night so that the site doesn’t melt down?
35 But Robb obvoiusly thinks it’s worth a go.
very good idea Dave
ABC Radio PM show are leading with Workchoices Mark 2 cover up.
This made my heart sink a little…. http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,22791429-5013871,00.html
When the Greens hold the balance of power in the Senate and Labor’s getting frustrated that they can’t pass their “slightly-less-WorkChoices-ish” IR legislation, this statement is going to come back to haunt them. Especially seeing as the Greens are much less inclined to compromise than the Dems were over the GST for eg.
That Downer, what a d1ck
Looks like little Lexy may save the day after all.
“Mr Downer says he wants the 16 countries at the meeting, including China and India, to sign an agreement on reducing greenhouse gas emissions.
“If we can get their agreement to energy intensity improvements, that is using energy more efficiently, if we can get their agreement to greater efforts in the area of reforestation, that would be a great achievement, that would be enormously important,” he said.
I can imagine him running back on his widdle fat legs saying ” You don’t have to vote us out , look look what we have, we’re green, we’re green, we believe, we believe.”
Its all the fault of the voters! heh
mc – I haven’t slept much this week and am a nervous wreck – god knows what William’s doing – I can’t even get a rational argument happening with myself – optimism level – ahhhhhh 60% – wringing hands
My campaign video playlist:
The sounds of silence (After John Howard)
The Party’s Over (The Party’s Over)
Forgotten Years (not, not… responsible)
Bright Side of Life (Dead Parrots Society)
For light relief and some serious satire: “Labor View from Broome’
37 Chris – desperation will do that to you. For this to work at all the allegation must be substantiated or you look tricky and this government doesn’t need another example of looking tricky.
Great question Dave, I have begun preliminary inquiries into doing just that. However, I am a complete babe in the woods when it comes to this kind of thing, so I would love to hear from anyone who has any expertise in this area. Email me at pollbludger – AT – bigpond – DOT – com.
Penny Wong demolished the Robb claim on 10 News. Robb looked flustered and uncertain – as though he was not really believing what he was saying.
I posted this on Possum Comitatus:
From the reporting, all that I can see is that the LNP has collected together a list of 13 candidates who were previously public servants. That’s all. They have taken George Newhouse’s situation and then said that “it might be possible” that the other candidates are in the same situation. The legal advice appears to pertain to the question of whether a by-election would have to be held if a candidate were found to have failed to resign in time. Well derrrr. We knew that a by-election was an inevitable result of such a finding.
See how slippery this is? No proof, just an assertion that they were public servants, therefore they may be in the same situation as the dill in Wentworth. They don’t actually have the proof at present that those 13 candidates have failed to resign. So the candidates are now being forced to come out and say they are okay, thereby distracting us from the IR referendum (oops sorry the election).
It may backfire on them actually – just heard the Victorian candidate on ABC 774 – great! 13 candidates, otherwise undistinguished, going on the media to confirm what great candidates they are!!
41 Bob Brown said at the national press Club that they would not block Labor’s Workplace Changes
Labor slams desperate libs
http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/story/0,21985,22790836-661,00.html
Mad Moo
No link just heard it on the 4:00 News (Qld Time).
It just smells very desparate and people don’t like technical arguments so it can only be a negative for the Libs. Look at Newhouse. Prior to all this talk he was getting no traction at all in Wentworth. Since then the whole electorate knows it is a tight race. I think it has helped him. And those well educated swingers in the eastern suburbs won’t like it at all as it smacks of smear….
there will be plenty more sh$t throwing before the week is out… Labor will do well not to throw too much back….
on more positive things… looking forward to the ministerial accountability announcement and linking that into AWB, Imigration department, Haneef… etc etc….
Even the Herald Sun is saying that this is likely to be a major embarrasement for the libs.
http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/story/0,21985,22790836-661,00.html
Cityblue @ 51: Well I’ll be. Bob Brown seems rather determined to embrace a Rudd govt, despite Rudd seemingly not wanting to know him.
Howard has moved out to 1.60 on centrebet (bennelong) for the first time in about 2 months or so.
NB Says:
November 20th, 2007 at 4:51 pm
Election 2007 Play List (In no particular order)
Excellent – now how about you configure it a an iTunes list…
Too late – its out there.
The lasting impression will be possible Labor stuff-up, not LNP smear.
Blindoptimist 907 in previous topic said:
“The coalition really must think the public are idiots – a fatally wrong assumption on their part, as they will soon discover”
Are you sure about that, remember Tampa, kids overboard, WMD, AWB and so the list goes on and on and on
“In what is likely to prove as a major embarrassment for Liberal Party campaign spokesman Andrew Robb, Labor has refuted claims the 13 hopefuls are all ineligible because they failed to resign from Commonwealth jobs before nominating for parliament.” (Herald – Sun)
This story just turned nasty on the Libs – the headlines tomorrow won’t be pleasant for them.
Rumour has it that Howard’s former mistress will go public in the next few days and declare herself against WorkChoices. Is this idle gossip or something else?
Nick @ 56 It shows that Bob Brown has learnt from the stuff ups by the Greens in Victoria and won’t allow the Greens to be labelled as “pro-Workchoices” like the greens in Victoria were labelled “pro-nuclear” when tehy voted down a anti-nuclear bill earlier this year.
This story had little time to be seen as a stuff up by Labor (of course it wasn;t anyway). The WHOLE story will be told tonight and tomorrow and it is a bad look for the Libs.
Thanks William for this free-fire zone!
Anyway, when the Libs are reduced to using websites as the basis for their claims its quite clear that they are trying to latch on to anything to distract attention for WorkChoices Mark 2, otherwise known as the “Arbiet Macht Frei” employment policy…
A person may well have been on a board, or council…it doesn’t make them responsible for the updating of the body’s bleeding website….
Give me a break
also, btw, has anybody seen Jeff Kennett with his new ‘tash? surely it must be done for charity…otherwise he’s angling for the job of “arbeits-gauleiter-uberalles-steh-auf” ambassadorship in a returned Howard government…..
and yes, I know what he is on the record as thinking of both Howard and Costello!
anyway, just hope the cameraden in the NSW Liberal right cabal are going to be up for a bit of counselling from beyond blue once this all goes down…alex hawke, david clarke and john howard group therapy is now in session…
And Guido: welcome back!
JIm @ 59:
Wrong mate, Labor has rejected it lock stock and barrel. This will hit the 6 O’clock news and the current affairs shows as a desparate Libs smear campaign gone wrong.!
Have you read that Hwoard doesn’t fake it with Costello?
http://www.smh.com.au/news/national/not-faking-pm/2007/11/20/1195321747836.html
@62: ???
ooppss, another own goal by the libs. I suggested they would implode but my God even I can’t believe how pathetic, panicked and desperate they have become.
One thing we do know now is they DO NOT believe they have a hope in hell. There is no way they would panic and clutch at desperation like this if they thought they had even a remote chance of hanging in.
Jim. it’s out there now??? are you kidding. average jo and joanne are stuck in their cars at peak hour listen to a couple of moron comedians spin tunes from 90’s boy bands and Oz idol winners. OR they are at home doing the after school battle with the kids… “no jimmy you cant have another coke. sit down and watch the telly or play your playstation!”. OR they are still at work, or at the gym etc….
its only us that have probably taken too much notice of this. it’ll all be gone in about 40 mins. Tony Jones will chuckle about tonight in his intro and then it will exist no more….
@60 Mr Fawlty
It’s grevious isn’t it.
cityblue @ 63: I like this new direction from the Greens, I think their moral high horse, holier than thou attitude has definitely hurt them in the past, and if they want to become a major contender they will need to make some painful ideological compromises of the kind that the major parties make all the time. This could be some small steps in the right direction imho.
Where has the ALP refuted the Andrew Robb claims?
62 Snoopy
That’ll rock my world!!
So have Labor responded? You must link when you reference! What sort of Lefty intellectual snobs are youz?
Oakes will go big time on the Robb blunder. It will be a shocking look for the Libs in tomorows MSM – reinforcing the “mean and tricky” image. Their campaign is unravelling like none other in recent memory.
Centrebet is narrowing though
Snoopy Doo Doo @ 73: right here – http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/story/0,21985,22790836-661,00.html
As Gillard said once before, the bastards will drown in their own mud.
Snoopy Doo Doo – try 52 for the link.
“Rumour has it that Howard’s former mistress will go public in the next few days and declare herself against WorkChoices. Is this idle gossip or something else?”
Yes, but what does his current mistress think?
William, just kicked some more in the tin for bandwidth, keep up the great work, will put some more in when my bets come in after Saturday (oh happy days).
Snoopy – Penny Wong held a press conference and called it desperate politics from a Government that had nothing to say.
the link:
http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/story/0,21985,22790836-661,00.html
Did anyone else here (straight) get perturbed by the Howard and Costello duo interview? How many think that ppl would have seen and heard that and gone ‘EEEwwwwWW!’
I know I was dry retching on the inside.
77 Historic Election – it is but the fit hasn’t hit the shan yet. What a stupid thing for Rob to do.
I am reading a book “Excellent cadavers” about the mafia assassination of the leading anti-mafia prosecutors, Falcone and Borsellino. After they were killed, everyone said “You just cant beat the mafia” except for one former mafiaboss turned informer who said “No, you are all wrong. This is a sign that they are totally desperate and they are about to lose.”
This desperate and despicable act by Team Rodent and Robb will be seen in the same light when the bloodbath takes place on Saturday. Let there be no compassion for such a deplorable bunch who have run the country based on the politics of greed and fear.
http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/story/0,21985,22790836-661,00.html
Read and weep Rodent felchers.
Tell me please, who is the current mistress, is it Dolly?
85 Gerr – please, do we have to talk about it? I’ll be eating very soon.
The Labor denial was firstly in edited into the original article. Then removed. You can limk to it as above, but it seems news has removed the denial from the main web page….?
And here:
http://www.news.com.au/story/0,23599,22790994-5012863,00.html
Robb ‘cobbled the information together from websites’
Geezuz H. Christ, and this guy is on the tax payers payroll.
Holy mother of god.
Snoopy Doo, cut the crap. Jim, you last post just proved if futher proof was nacessary, that you are a vile little toad.
I’d far rather the Democrats hold the balance of power than the Greens or FF.
LIBERAL Party assertions that 13 Labor candidates are ineligible to stand in Saturday’s election are ‘baseless, ridiculous and desperate’ the ALP has claimed.
In what is likely to prove as a major embarrassment for Liberal Party campaign spokesman Andrew Robb, Labor has refuted claims the 13 hopefuls are all ineligible because they failed to resign from Commonwealth jobs before nominating for parliament.
Mr Robb said legal advice suggested the ALP candidate for Wentworth, George Newhouse, may be ineligible for parliament and had compounded the problem by refusing to release relevant documentation.
Twelve other ALP candidates may be similarly affected, Mr Robb said.
However, Labor has just released a statement saying all 13 resigned from their positions in accordance with electoral guidelines.
”All 13 candidates standing for the Australian Labor Party in this Saturday’s election are eligible to stand for public office,” ALP spokesman Alex Cramb said. ”This afternoon’s press conference by Andrew Robb was pure desperation.
”The claims against the 13 ALP candidates cited by Andrew Robb were cobbled together from web sites. All 13 candidates are valid and they resigned.
”Mr Robb’s claims are baseless, desperate and ridiculous. These claims are completely untrue.
The Liberal party is desperate. They have nothing left to say”
wow.
so what are the odds on Goldstien now ?
Gerr – I saw a clip of it after one on Kevin and Therese’s Morning interview. Costello was talking about his political marriage with Rodent – very unpleasant conjunction of associations.
91 Jim – I think you’ll find you are looking at the original story and not the updated one. Penny Wong was on the news.
Glen.. The Natasha or Meg Lees Democrats?
My wife was watching it at the time ( I refuse to listen to anything Howards says anymore and walked out when it was on ) and she reckons it would of turned even the gays off as well. !
ON Channel 10 news Paul Bongiorno just ripped the Libs a new one – “transparent”, “apparently the member in Hinkler is supposed to be working for a agency that no longer exists..”
ALP response is still included in this article on the GG
http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,22791352-601,00.html
hahahahhaahahaha The Liberal Party’s legal evidence that the Labor candidates are ineligible?
They red it on the Labor party website.
What a bunch of jokers.
i have to say, with the Howard/Costello love-in, the stupid statement by Robb and Howard yesterday promising never ever to repeal, change and virtually set in stone the workchoices legislation for ever (or is that ‘never ever’), it really does seem that their polling must be telling them it’s all over.
Nick @ 41
The Greens have given a public commitment to support Labor’s legislation to get rid of WorkChoices, but the Greens will move amendments to strengthen workers’ rights.
They will be amendments that a lot of unions, who are disappointed wth Labor’s Workchoices lite position, will want.
I hear the creaking sounds of an impending ugly implosion.
Smirk had the interview first on Sky, accusing Labour of not submitting costings and intimating that this was illegal – then came Robb – Smirk couldnt make the accusations, but let it up to Robb to do the dirty work on Newhouse and the other 12 – and intimating this was illegal as well – I wonder why – duhhh
RGee the Democrats that could work well with both sides of politics Liberals and Labor.
Anybody but the Greens, and FF really.
Getting ahead of myself.
Anyone ever seen the original Italian Job? With Michael Caine?
Remember the scene when they pull off the Italian job and news gets back to UK and partic the Mr Big Noel Coward character in jail?
Remember the scene when all the prison inmates chant and bang their pots and chant Mr Big’s name (cant remember what it is exactly) and Mr Big turns to them like he’s onstage after a grand shakespearean performance?
That’l be Rudd on Sat night.
Family First will vote with the Liberals on social issues, and with Labor on economic issues.
Why would the Libs pick someone so unappealing as Robb to go on the news with this? Especially since he’s going to draw fire from the telegenic, articulate Penny Wong.
The whole Robb 13 thing was about Wentworth – shows that they really think they will lose the seat.
Howard and Costello looked like that old gay couple reminiscing on the ‘good old days’, how they survived together in the face of adversity after all those years, stroking up each other egos. For a minute I thought they were about to hold hands. Made me want to vomit. What they forgot to ask was “Peter would you turn gay for Johnnie ” who knows maybe he already has.
Haven’t heard from Adam for a few days….
Centrebet now Maxine 2.2, Rattie 1.60, the narrowing, the narrowing.
114: Dinsdale Piranha
Check a few of the old threads.
He said he’d be too busy to contribute until the election.
Rates Analyst, reply from the previous thread.
The North Sydney Poll was reported on the Blog http://blogs.crikey.com.au/pollbludger/728
Adelaide Advertiser Polls, showing a 10% swing to Labor in Hindmarsh and 14% in Adelaide.
http://www.news.com.au/adelaidenow/story/0,22606,22638480-5006301,00.html
http://www.news.com.au/adelaidenow/story/0,22606,22649966-5006301,00.html
I predict the outer suburban electorates will hold up for the government, while much more safer inner city ones fall to Labor. Say the Liberals in Victoria retaining Latrobe, while losing Kooyong and maybe Higgins. The inner city small ‘l’ Liberal progressives have been wanting to stick it into the Howard government for ages, now they will.
Robb’s legal advise is worth as much as Turnbull’s Rain Machine.
Oh look, only 545pm and already its a “major embarrassment for the LIbs”. As predicted.
Their useless campaign team needs to be taken to the knackery.
As I said in the other thread if Newhouse wins Wentworth and they force a byelection the only result is to make the seat safer for him.
After all this is what happened in Lindsay in 1996. As William himself has stated.
Labor’s Ross Free held Lindsay by margins of around 10 per cent throughout the Hawke-Keating years, having previously been member for Macquarie from 1980.
He was most unpleasantly surprised to find himself voted out in 1996, following an epochal 11.9 per cent swing to Liberal candidate Jackie Kelly.
Free was able to secure a re-match because Kelly, who did not expect to win, had failed to get her affairs in order before nominating (she was still serving as an RAAF officer, an “office for profit under the Crown”). Voters dragged back to the polls on a technicality rewarded Free with a further 6.8 per cent drop in the primary vote, and Kelly picked up another 5.0 per cent on two-party preferred.
The combined 16.9 per cent swing to the Liberals meant the electorate’s demographic profile came to be seen as typifying John Howard’s constituency – high numbers of skilled workers on good incomes, low levels of tertiary education and a distinctly less multicultural flavour than suburbs closer to the city.
116, i put on a bet at $2.70 ill be a happy man if the rodent loses his seat
If the Libs had just gone after Newhouse they MAY have been able to make a case or at least give the impression they had one, but as usual they went too far and included 12 others. Now, because they’ve been found out to be wrong on these 12, their case against Newhouse is obliterated along with the 12.
The Libs are covered in it and the steam is arising.
“Why would the Libs pick someone so unappealing as Robb to go on the news with this?”
When you look at the alternatives available they probably drew his name out of a hat.
Has Loughnane been boned and Robb is now running the show?
Thanks Tristan
To all those Labor hacks here, what evidence has your HQ put out that proves that these nominations were legal?
This talk of previously safe liberal seats looking risky while holding on to the spiv vote is very similar to what happened in the US from the 1960s onwards. The democrats were once the party of the rural south, while the republicans were the party of old money and industry in the north. Civil rights, Vietnam and oil shocks changed all that, and now, as we know, the “red states” are in the south and the democrats hold the north east, north west and California
Are we witnessing an “inversion” in Australia?
A-C, The burden of proof lies with Robb.
A-C
How does a candidate resign from a position that no longer exists?
A-C@128, Half of the organisations the Libs are saying the candidates work for don’t even EXIST any longer.
what was that site that was going to have booth by booth results on saturday night?
it really is no surprise that this mean and vicious group of ‘born-to-rulers’ would be mean and viscous right up to the bitter end – they should all go home and write an essay about dignity. They certainly aren’t going to bow out graciously…
The fact the Liberal’s evidence is a webpage!
http://www.orgburo.com/elections/
The last time a defendant was required to disprove allegations was the Spanish Inquisition….
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ZQI0Xm29To
My HoR and senate prediction as entered into the Crikey tipping competition. I used the Roy Morgan senate poll to get my senate results so I will probably be way off
http://australiavotes2007.blogspot.com/2007/11/my-prediction.html
“(Centrebet CEO) Mr Kafataris said he was surprised by the volume of election betting taking place.
“In one hour this morning, we took $120,000 on Labor from $1.20 to $1.17 and $100,000 on the Coalition at around $5.”
“It’s unbelievable … the interest in it.”
“The election book is our biggest turnover book of the year. We would hold upwards of $4 to $5 million on the event.”
http://news.ninemsn.com.au/article.aspx?id=104544
This farce and further loss of a day to put out any positive messages was authorised by B Loughnane, Liberal Party, Canberra.
Am I right to assume this whole candidacy thing has been overblown and will be quickly forgotten?
“In what is likely to prove as a major embarrassment for Liberal Party campaign spokesman Andrew Robb….”
Herald Sun tells the truth….
109
Glen Says:
November 20th, 2007 at 5:40 pm
RGee the Democrats that could work well with both sides of politics Liberals and Labor.
Anybody but the Greens, and FF really
————————————————-
That is complete nonsense – the Democrats concur with the greens on like 95% of issues. Therefore if the Greens are radical, so are the Democrats, and so are the scientists that provide the foundation for their policies. If anything, The Coalition should be getting a battering from the media on their ‘dirty’ labelling.
They have legal opinion for Wentworth, the 12 other allegations are just fear, uncertainty, and doubt based on Labor candidate resumes. It doesn’t take into account whether or not they have resigned. It just says sometime in their past they had government jobs.
Hi all can’t stay long but this was in Crikey today:
2. The Kevin conundrum
Christian Kerr writes:
The most interesting poll appears only after a federal election. It is the Australian National University’s Australian Electoral Survey.
It asks: “When did you decide how you would definitely vote in this election?”
In 2004, 14.2% of respondents answered “A few days before the election”, with 8.6% saying they only made up their minds on the day. That means that at this stage in the last campaign, more than one in five voters had not yet made up their minds.
We are four days away from the election. All the polls point to a Labor win. But what if they are missing something? Labor only needs a swing of 4.8% to win government, but if things are like last time more than 20% of the electorate are yet to decide how they are going to vote.
Last week many papers ran photos of Kevin Rudd in his school nerd days, as captain of the Nambour High debating team. He seems to have forgotten one crucial lesson from back then. You can make a fantastic case in a debate, but if you do not rebut your opponents’ arguments you simply will not win.
There is a real danger in Rudd’s election strategy. He says he will barely change a thing. So why should voters change the government?
Crikey’s Morgan polling tries to identify “soft” Labor voters, people who believe the country is heading in the right direction, but still say they are voting Labor.
There are plenty of them. According to Morgan’s most recent face-to-face poll, 21% of all electors are soft Labor voters. What if they change their minds?
The polls say we will elect a Labor government, but they also say we believe the Liberals are superior economic managers, even after the recent interest rate rise. That contradicts political logic.
“I can’t explain why they are going to throw the government out,” one Labor MP told me last week. “I have a nagging worry they won’t.”
“They like the message, but they don’t like the messenger,” a senior Liberal staffer said of their research into voters’ views.
“They don’t like Howard, they don’t like Costello but they like the government and like Rudd,” another explained.
“Rudd’s popular, but he hasn’t made a case for change,” a minister claimed.
Liberal MPs say that they have not picked up any real anger with the government, yet report a desire for change. That is the conundrum of this campaign.
Kevin Rudd has said he is an economic conservative. For most of the time he has been Labor leader, he has gone out of his way to minimise the policy differences between his party and the Liberals. So if Rudd represents no change – or little change – why change governments? It would just be change for change’s sake.
Australians are conservative about changing federal governments. We have only done it five times since World War II, and never when the economy looks so robust.
Will the undecided voters back the government? Will the soft Labor voters stop their flirtation? The ANU’s Ian McAllister says undecided voters “tend to be swayed by policies, they tend to be swayed by their own particular economic self-interest”.
He describes them as “people who are making much more rational calculating decisions about their votes”.
Or will the votes of people yet to make up their minds likely to follow the direction the polls have pointed in all year? We will have the answer soon enough.
Send your tips to boss@crikey.com.au , submit them anonymously here or SMS tips and photos to 0427 TIP OFF.
Channel 7 news Melbourne was on Workchoices and a cover up by the Libs and nothing else. Fantastic.
John of Melbourne, it’s quite well known psychologically that people say they make up their minds in the last days or on their way just so it sounds like their open to the suggestion of changing their mind.
In actual fact there’s very little difference between polling aggregates and the final result.
Gary Bruce, it was the same with 9 news. Of course we can expect screaming headlines in the News Ltd tabloids tomorrow:
“RUDD SHOCK: 13 CANDIDATES CAN’T BE ELECTED, FIND OUT IT ONE IS YOURS”
William – another suggestion to save on bandwidth – have the site default to the last page of comments, not the first, after someone posts a comment. Otherwise you automatically incur two page views (one to load the first page, another to get to the most recent page).
A-C your obvious anger over how the Libs have stuffrd this up is understandable.
Patrick Bateman I concur, you can do it William.
Turnbull’s campaign workers have been spotted removing Greens placards on electricity poles in Wentworth and putting up his ones instead. As a Greens member normally I would feel annoyed by that, but it is an encouraging sign that the Liberal party is desperate.
ding buzz
ding buzz
ding buzz
HAHAHAHAHA…..no mention of the “Mr Robb 13″ on channel eddy in Melbourne
Howard says he hasnt encountered anger over workchoices.
http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2007/11/20/2096283.htm?section=justin
Did he forget to add “in my own household” or “while praying at church on Sunday”
RE Wombat no mention on PM either at least in the first 20 minutes I heard. Probably too late to make the news.
Yep, nothing on either Channel 7 or 9 news on the 13 “ineligible” candidates. The media might already be marking this as a baseless scare tactic and moving on.
148 Lose the election please – your right in that it will be in the papers tomorrow but you have the heading wrong. It will be along the lines of “Libs shoot themselves in the foot”. They have proven to be incorrect. This is ‘embarrassment’ time.
HAHAHAHA……………..no mention of Mr Robb or his crap on channel eddy in Melbourne!
But the ABC TV News will spin it in favour of Howard
cb, I find myself getting there fast …. my optimism level though is very high, it is just the angst, top to bottom, from the other side that I am finding at times difficult to deal with. This is my first federal election in Australia. Have other elections always been like this in the last week or is this election unique in that respect? I don’t have any other to personally judge it by.
mb, if you’re really lucky you might get a celebrity to help out with handing out HTV cards on the day!
Senator Heffernan.
How can you say that Xenophon has improved the chances for The Greens? His preferences are split evenly between Family First and The Greens. If FF (who have a strong presence in SA and outpolled The Greens in the Upper House in the 2006 state election) outpoll The Greens, then they will be the ones who benefit from Nick’s surplus. Xenophon’s entry has pretty much halved The Greens’ chances.
The tawdryness of this latest Liberal attack on Labor reminds me of Malaysia’s Dr.Mahatir’s attacks on his political enemies. the outrageous lies and dissembling, the low Macchiavellian cunning of the accusations, the abuse of the trappings of office, the manipulation of the compliant media, it is all there.
I love this country, but I am ashamed and disgusted at what it has become politically because of the actions and ruthless mentality of it’s leadership and Government over the last eleven years.
I don’t know how things will pan out under the Rudd administration. I can only hope they will put an end to my embaressment as a citizen of this nation. It won’t take much to be an improvement.
William is already aware of the comment submission -> back to front page issue.
regarding using IRC…
William Bowe@,
May I take this opportunity to thank and congratulate you for providing the great work/service.
Please keep in mind that IRC programs/protocols are blocked for many of us at work.
This will not be a big deal on election day (Saturday) and “celebration day” (Sunday
where most if not all of us will be at home.
During week days / working days, however, this might be a problem.
PS. Will you run this blog beyond next week, William?
NOBODY EXPECTS THE SPANISH INQUISITION.
But seriously, I thought the last time a defendant was required to disprove allegations was about three months ago in an attempted Queensland show trial run by Kevin Andrews and Mick “incompetent” Keelty. Luckily for the defendant they were able to disprove it, this time.
#1
Can I include ‘Ding Dong, the witch is dead’ in the play list?
This is just the thing to spur ALP supporters on till Saturday!
Same for me – the very first thing I thought of was Singapore and Russia, elections being rigged indirectly by declaring opposition candidates “illegal” or “ineligible” or otherwise using the courts as an avenue to shut them down.
The ALP should seek an urgent injuction in the High Court preventing the Libs from peddling these lies until after the election. They would get one.
Do you think the Libs ever intended the 13 candidates story to be a major thing? Is it possible it was just made as some throw-away comment that got blown into a big story?
I haven’t seen the footage so I couldn’t know.
HA HA HA HA
We have 2 new contenders for “Stuffup Of The Campaign Award!” –
Andrew Robb and Brian Lochnane.
This was so scandalous Laurie Oakes didn’t even mention it on Nine news.
It’s funny how Glen and his Liberal troll mates have gone quiet all of a sudden
The Liberals will already be regretting they have made these absurd allegations. To the extent they havemade news, they’ve largely made the Liberals look ridiculous and distracted from any chance they had to put a more positive message out. The day’s news is the workchoices cover-up and bungling, unsubstantiated allegations against their opponents. Another terrible day on the march to oblivion.
what do people think is where Penny Wong’s future lies?
i see her as a future Attorney General. Oh to have a person of her standard as the country’s guardian instead of the Walking Dead Ruddock.
she is immensely impressive amongst a lot of hacks on either side of the benches.
where do others see her ending up?
John of Melbourne 145
There have always been voters who make up their minds late in the piece.
But all the evidence shows their votes break the same way as those who made up their minds earlier.
The election is over. As to why the government is getting thrown out on its ear at a time of great prosperity, no one knows. Hence all the nagging doubts about whether it will happen.
But happen it will.
It will only be for Saturday, Frank. Yes, this site will stagger on beyond next week. Thankfully, a huge election drought is looming.
Penny Wong would make a very good Attorney General. She is a smart lady.
a drop in the ocean, mebbe scare a few Wentworth voters into sticking with Turnbull, more importantly it gets the WC2 stuff off the air. The only thing it actually “proves” is that Newhouse is a moron
But I think most ppl already knew that and quite a few are going to vote for him anyway
163. Therapy:
1. Split ticket A goes to greens, B goes to fundies first. Like Donkey Vote, more people will choose ticket A. Plus many Liberal voters and more Labor voters will go with ticket A then B, because the Greens are supported more than ff generally.
2. I’m betting the Greens will outpoll FF by atleast 4% in the senate – the recent polls have shown that, plus if you have been aware during the campaign, a bet such as that is logical.
Penny Wong is ineligible to be Attorney General because she is a lesbian.
She certainly seems very capable and principled.
However, she’s backed by the left, so promotion opportunities may be limited in the current ALP – especially coming from SA, home of the SDA.
Hmm, I think Penny Wong could be a great A-G… Another option would be something like Assistant Treasurer, if they wanted to give that job to the Senate. She’s very quick.
regarding the “13 candidates ineligible…”
It is a win-win situation for Howard nevertheless. Even if it turns out a dud, it serves to distract public / media from scrutinising other serious embarrassment for Howard, say WorkChoice.2,… you name it!
The loss of Marise Payne would be one of the true tradgedies of this election. She is one of the most intelligent, compassionate and decent politicians on either side of politics. If she is defeated I hope she continues in politcs or in some other capacity in public life. Both sides of politics need more like her.
Spiros
We have had a gay Prime Minister before, I don’t see wht we can’t have a gay AG.
Ok, ok, settle down people. There are only two possibilities. The allegation that 13 Labor candidates are ineligibile to stand is either true or untrue.
If it’s untrue, the Libs will be crucified. It will be seen as the last desperate throw of the dice by a clapped-out, hysterical bunch of scare-monkeys.
If it’s true in whole or part, consider the prospect of Labor, in Government with a healthy margin, immediately facing between 1 and 13 by-elections.
That’s the chance of getting between 1 and 13 Jackie Kellys. A chance of increasing their bag from, say, 85, by a good 10 seats.
These are, after all, seats that Labor is probably not gonna need to win to form government in any event. Apart from Wentworth, none are marginals.
Byelections in seats like Ryan will give the good people there a chance to “get with the strength”, as it were, having already seen what the rest of the country has done to Howard and his Merry Men.
They’ve done it before at a byelection and may relish the chance to do it again.
frank frederic, your logic would be impeccable if Howard was way in front.
But he is way behind. This just chews up valuable catching up time.
So what if Penny Wong is a lesbian – at least she has the guts to admit it. She is a smart, very capable woman. Who she chooses to get her rocks off with is irrelevant.
#183
But Frank all those things you WC2 etc got mentioned on ch9 news in Melbourne but not the “dirty 13″……hahaha
Spiros #180.?? I hope that was intended as a joke or an attempt at being sardonic. Otherwise it is the utterance of a fool and I dont believe you are that.
Regarding the nomination “scandal” I flicked between both Seven and Nine news here in Sydney to see how it played out.
Both bulletins led off with lengthy stories about the Workchoices cover-up and featured the same wonderful footage of the Prime Miniature looking shifty and uncomfortable as he answered the media’s questions about it.
Seven briefly mentioned the nomination “scandal” at the end of the report with a brief snippet of Robb’s press conference followed by Penny Wong’s eloquent reply. Nine DIDNT EVEN MENTION IT!
If what I hear about Paul Bongiorno’s comments on Ten News is true (ie that he said it was all a desperate Lib beat-up) Id call that a clean sweep for Labor!
ruawake 188, I was making an ironic point about stupid claims about ineligibility.
We’ve had a clinically dead A-G for some time now, so what’s wrong with a lesbian one?
Cheers Spiros.
Penny Wong would be absolutely fantastic as AG.
“Howard says he hasnt encountered anger over workchoices.”
That is because his nine bodyguards keep people at a distance.
All of his appearences are carefully staged managed with his minders gently grabbing his arm and directing him to the next friendly encounter.
If Howard had had the guts to attend the Melbourne Cup then he and Australia would have seen how unpopular he and his laws are.
But that is why he did not attend, not a good look to be roundly derided on national TV in the middle of an election campaign.
The Libs ploy could easily backfire on them too. If any of those candidates loses by a few votes, you can be sure there will be a court challenge due to the implication even though it was false.
arbie
who?
Christian W – yep I caught Channel 10 at the half way point in their news when they do a recap of the main stories, they then did a cross to Bongiorno with the line “And Paul how damaging will this be to the ALP?”
He almost laughed.
After he finished, my wife said “Wow! talk about an ad for the ALP”.
Will from Kooyong, taking that a step further, it would be truly hilarious if Labor lost the election by razor-thin margins in, say, one or two seats, and used this smear to overturn the margin.
What a bunch of Nervous Nellies on this eligibility thing you all are!
Robb is “playing with Labor’s mind” on this one.
HE is demanding that LABOR nominees produce proof THEIR nomination is valid. What a bloody cheek! They just can’t get it out of their thick heads that they are NOT born to rule. After Saturday there’ll be more more “demanding” anyone produce anything. They’ll be out of office.
This is how the public will see it, too.
The Libs are a bunch of tools. This will play badly for them.
Evan @ 186
2 of the other 12 are marginals. 1 in QLD and 1 in SA. If it is true Howard has pulled another rabbit out of his hat and this one is from ‘Monty Python: The Holy Grail’. Quick were is the Holy Hand Granade.
Arbie J @ 185,
“We have had a gay Prime Minister before”
Which Prime Minister was that?
Forgive me if someone’s already pointed this out (have not had time to read all previous posts), but I was just looking at Portlandbet and Labor are now favourites in Corangamite.
JWH drowning, not waving.
Kiwipundit,
‘Pixie’ McMahon.
Julie @ 161
This election is unique. Normally, the libs run a pretty tight campaign, on message. Howard in control. This one has been a shambles. All over the place. I believe it will go down as their worst in recent history. However, it goes further than just the campaign. Many Australian voters proclaim to not giving a rats about politics but are ruthless when they are dudded. They also have long memories. It all adds up. They have turned on Howard. I am nervous, but … I feel something in the air. I went to a rally in Melbourne and cheered my head off for Gough Whitlam. Now, it seems It’s Time …
BTW, no mention of Robb on ABC’s PM.
It will be interesting to see how this plays in the morning papers, particularly if the News Ltd papers beat it up for all it’s worth. Probably be lead story in the GG, but really, who cares.
If the tabloids go heavy on it, it could become an issue.
I totally agree.
She is one of the only Lib senators (along with Georgiou and Brandis and one or two others) who is prepared to rise above party politics on matters of real importance. It is a reflection of the pathetic state of the Lib machine that she’s third on the ticket and likely to pay for the hard right wing of her party’s mistakes at this election.
# 11 William
If you have the Comment ordering set like thus;
$paged_comments->ordering = ‘ASC’;
And your your Default page value set to
$paged_comments->default_page = ‘auto’; OR ‘first’
then you will get the behaviour you are seeing.
change the default page value to
$paged_comments->default_page = ‘last’;
OR change
$paged_comments->ordering = ‘ASC’; to
$paged_comments->ordering = ‘DESC’;
and leave
$paged_comments->default_page = ‘auto’;
either or dependign on presentation preference, give it a go and see if that does what you want.
Hope that makes sense
It’s been rumoured that the Libs are a bit short of cash!
They’ve spent a motza on advertising, mail Etc.
They’re going to spend a fortune in challenges in the Supreme Court???
Wouldn’t it be a delicious irony if the party of ‘Australia’s Greatest Economic Team’ went bankrupt after the election.
I used to be a credit manager and if I were Australia Post or a TV Station I’d have ‘em on no more than a 7 day account.
Speaking of the A/G someone should ask Ruddock how much he got for his soul.
A lot of nervous nellies on this blog – relax and think of the numbers 85 & 53/47. May I ask those who are not confident of a comfortable ALP win, under what set of circumstances would you be?
Under no circumstances
It beggars belief that the ALP’s due diligence would be so lax as to let through a dozen disqualified candidates. One or two maybe if they were latecomers in safe coalition seats.
I notice Robb denied using government resources to inquire as to the job statuses of the candidates concerned. (Not that that would give them any insight as to state govt posts, or probably local govt or academic ones).
Does anyone know where the ‘released’ legal advice can be found?
Pancho’s ‘The ABC of Johnny’s Empire’, now with soundtrack
http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=0yfGLa9YcIY
Speaking of the Senate (where this blog originally started) I attempted to predict the Senate based on Antony Greens predictions for each state. If the ALP win the Lower house (which to me seems a given – I have them at 87 to 90 seats) they have almost no chance of having control in the Senate.
I mangled and crunched the Senate numbers as much as possible but still came up with a new Senate of :
ALP 30
LIB/NP 38
GREEN 5
FF 2
DEM 1
These figures mean that the ALP will need Minor party support for every bill to get any laws passed. Even one defector from the minor parties defeat the bill in the Senate…..I grant my prediction could be wrong BUT:
a) Why has there been so little attention given to this important outcome? Its hardly had a whisper!
b) Is a Double Dissolution a real possibility?
ABC on line leading with the story but a fairly balanced article
http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2007/11/20/2096105.htm
Those who have allegiance to a foreign power are ineligible to stand. What is Tony Abbott’s position given his allegiance to the Bishop of Rome (the Sovereign of the Vatican State)
Nice of Robb to let us all in on the fact that internal Lib polling is suggesting things are as dire as all the published polls suggest.
Graeme@214
‘Office of Profit’ is very complicated, not many solicitors are prepared to make a judgement. However, it applies to anywhere or anything, renumeration or whatever from the Government, State or Federal. In fact, if you are in a private company with Government contracts, such as acting as a ‘advisor’ to Government, you could well be judged to be in an ‘Office of Profit’
Did anyone hear Robb say ‘helligible’?
216 AJ,
If the prediction concerning the Senate is true, then of course a double dissolution is theoretically possible, once the bills have gone thorough the requisite number of times and been defeated. We could then completely cleanse the Parliament of this unrepresentative swill.
McMahon
AJ if the Coalition had 38 senators then Labor would need more than the support of minor parties. If the 38 voted together they would be able to negative any vote. 76/2=38.
All these scenarios about the Senate voting assumes the Nats will vote with the Libs. Joyce has already said he will support the Labor IR changes. Smart heads may not want a DD and be prepared to deal.
So Barnaby won’t be dealing, GG?
Remember Barnaby – he will vote for the IR bills. Maybe.
Apologies to William for my “yay me first” comment on the Newspoll thread
Everyone thinks nothing will come of this 13 ineligible seats stuff?
If they weren’t a mile behind, would the Libs be mentioning possible court challenges?
If they did challenge, wouldn’t that make them unpopular?
GG
The duplicitious Joyce only said that to try and win the seat for Boswell over the Greens.
in other words:
election lie No. 12568
Joyce will be an independent within the Senate within a year if he supports Labor’s IR laws. If for some reason the Nats don’t expel him, he will never get preselection for the Senate again and he would have to stand by himself or with some micro-party.
In news just to hand, the Liberal Party campaign chief Brian Loughnane has announced the Coalition has employed Donald Segretti to assist over the final few days of the election.
Mr Loughnane says he expects Mr Segretti will fit right in with the Liberal’s team and ethos. He also indicated he is seeking the avaliability of Howard Hunt.
When asked for a comment, John Howard merely replied “expletive deleted”.
179
blehygu
A split senate ticket splits the “1 above the line” 50-50 between FF and The Greens in Xenophon’s case, it’s not the same as handing out 2 how to vote cards (a lower house “split ticket”).
can’t say where i work but overheard a phone conversation this afternoon, (paraphrasing) “…yeah, we’ve checked it with payroll and they’ve got nothing to worry about….”
Grog: was that ratf**king?
#204 MGM, so currently on Portlandbet 81-67-2?
Spiros, surely it doesn’t matter which Greek island Penny Wong comes from.
I’ll be very interested to hear what the Rodent makes of this desperate smear on 7.30 report.
Mr. Rudd – Show us your WAY!!!!
http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=BKmXSYi49IU
Now we just have to wait for Rudd’s “Cannuk letter”
161 Julie – I’ve been waiting all these years for this – you can’t believe how sweet it will be
Barnaby will be trying to extract advantage for his constituency. He will deal if it is in his interests. A DD is likely to increase the number of Greens and minor parties because the quota threshold will be halved. This would not necessarily be to the Nats advantage.
NEW ECONOMIC RISK COALITION AD:
I’m not sure it will work. The sky can’t be blue and falling in at the same time.
C-Woo, the reaction in my house was to laugh. That ad-man’s voice is just in EVERY single Coalition ad. The naff descriptions that they give to the ALP members is just silly.
Re. Actors in Labor ads…
Howard says “If there are so many disadvantaged workers how come Labor has to use actors. Why not use real people?”
One might say the same thing about the Lib ads: if there are so many in the cheersquad for WorkChoices, how come the Libs employ actors?
The 13 “doubtful” nominees in Labor’s team are just the ones that came from the PS or similar before they became candidates. Robb has no evidence at all. He’s bluffing. There is NO need for Labor to respond in any way. Let Robb and his Tory mates rot in political oblivion after Saturday.
Derek at 207
How do we know that it was Howard in charge in previous elections? Maybe the smarts came from Arthur Sidonis? This election is demolishing so many myths about Howard.
#241 Yes, Julia Gillard is a “fanatic”, Peter Garrett is an “extremist”, and Swan and Rudd are “learners”.
Any nominations for descriptions Labor could use in an ad featuring their equivalents – Vaile, Turnbull, Costello and Howard? You could throw Abbott in for a laugh too.
ABC Sydney led with the Workchoices thing, followed by the candidates thing. Also had visual of Penny Wong strongly denying the claims. Penny’s a good choice, but Rudd would be better…
#242 Bushfire Bill…maybe the coalition can’t afford actors. They just seem to use black and white photos of former Labor PMs and current shadow ministers. Perhaps they can’t even afford colour photos.
#233 Boll, yes 81 ALP should be right as I think Page took it to 80. I noticed some narrowing action in other seats, Cowper for instance, which hasn’t moved for quite some time.
Um – what happened?
Antonio 244
Vaile – sharp as a bowling ball
Turnbull – unreliable
Costello – lazy/gutless
Howard – yesterday’s man
Abbott – unstable
Sorry about the comment ordering reversal. To be corrected shortly.
The things is Swing Lowe – no need for Rudd to challenge little Andrew Robb. If Rudd turns up it looks like a story, if the ALP can only be bothered to bring out Penny Wong, well…
All Rudd and Julia have to do is just trash it when asked, no need to call a press conference to give the story oxygen.
The last time the Libs used a real person in their Work Choice ads they ended up being prosecuted.
I did the GG on-line poll. I recommend it highly. The best questions are; “If John Howard was a dog, what sort would he be?’ Then the same for Rudd. So, that’s new party game we can all play. I said Howard is a mean, but cowardly, pit-bull and that Rudd was a hardworking, honest blue heeler. But any dog has to be nicer than Howard.
ShowsOn Says… at 6:03 pm
The legal advice is based of course on the presumption that the candidate was working in an “office for profit” . It’s a no brainer. It’s the LNP’s Robb going on Mastermind with special subject “The Bleeding Obvious” in relation only to what the legislation says, backed up by case law, as the case may be.
As a practitioner myself, as I see it, I vehemently object to the political use of perfectly legitimate and absolutely correct advice which is then presented politically, using the imprimatur of a Senior Counsel, with an underlying, inherently disgraceful political insinuation, namely a presumption of guilt in an election period.
If they have the evidence, shoot. If not, shut up for decency’s sake.
217 midnothcoast
‘Those who have allegiance to a foreign power are ineligible to stand. What is Tony Abbott’s position given his allegiance to the Bishop of Rome (the Sovereign of the Vatican State)’
Or indeed Rattus’ position given his allegiance to the Dark Lord?
The Libs are practically begging for a landslide now.
What a laughable performance they’ve put up in this campaign.
Great impersonation of hopeless amateurs.
Rudd would be a poodle. All show….
You can get legal opinion on anything. When asked to provide advice you provide advice on any possible legal route to take, no matter how slim the chance of success.
I find it doubtful Newhouse, as a lawyer, wouldn’t understand all the eligibility criteria. You have to wonder whether they’d be bothering all this Newhouse bother if Turnbull was getting over 50% in the primaries (as LaborVoter contends).
Did anyone see the Bob Day and Tony Zappia (will be volunteering in Makin for him) and probably going to watch the vote at his office on Saturday Night.
God, he’s a tool.
Anyone think the Libs will now send out letters in all those seats warning the voters that the Labor candidate may be illegible?
260
Of course they will. This is as low as you can go.
(And i’m sorry if I gave away my political leaning!)
Hey, that wasn’t so hard. Thanks Slain, I should have worked that one out long ago.
It does sound desperate from the Libs to be questioning the validity of the candidates.
There you go William… becoming a technical mastermind.
Interesting comment on David Pemberty’s blog today about the TT interview:
Hmm – I thought it was pretty soft. The hilarious thing is, here are two blokes who’ve never even had dinner together like normal friends do, and they’re four days away from what looks like defeat, and they finally decide after 11 years to sit down together for a matey chat on the couch. It looked desperate. The only interesting thing about it was the novelty of seeing them sit together. It was a great coup by Seven to get the interview, but i suspect they secured it on the basis of keeping it very, very tame, because they could really have hopped into the leadership, the mechanics of this confusing handover – you name it.
Works good Will
229 grog
So theoretically,
Donald Segretti
equals
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ratfucking
equals
need to edit wikipedia for new Antipodean definition, post 24/11/07 ???
Sid Mariss’s piece in the GG notes that Gary Parr’s “crime” is to be listed as a member of the Bundaberg Ports Authority council. The Lib party hack who turned this one up didn’t bother to do any further research, otherwise they would have found the BPA had merged with Brisbane Ports Authority in May 07 and Parr’s council position came to an end at that time.
It’s becoming obvious the “public record” search Robb kept harping on about was someone googling for candidates names, and the substance of the claims comes down to organisations not updating their websites.
Congratulations on a fine “own goal” to Andrew Robb
Notice this week the absence of the big spend. If Rudd had matched Howard last week, it would have been open slather in the last few days – especially from the Liberals. Rudd effectively ensured the rabbit stayed in the warren. Brilliant strategy.
And Swing Lowe at 245: A Rudd response would have led the news – the wrong message. As it was, Rudd kept on message with his petition and Workchoices.
For the coalition calling for Labor candidates being out of touch
Pot. Kettle. Black.
El Rodent on 7:30Report
William, How do I make a financial contribution to this site for us tragics?
Andrew Robb the Elmer Fudd of Australian politics with his mantra of: It’s wabbit season.
ROFLMAO
So far Howard’s had to justify the papers he wont release regarding WorkChoices – 4 minutes wasted – love it!
272 alpal – go to the home page. Paypal button on the left hand side.
btw has anyone seen esj? im wondering if he came good & put $100 into williams account.
Given the tracking of wikipedia edits, I’ll let you do it JFC!
Cue: http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=qF6WMUm0fUw
William, the first change (making the comment appear on the same page it was submitted from) means you should see some serious reduction in your bandwidth usage. It at least takes away one extra page visit after (previously) being redirected to the first page on comment submission – cool
Hmm perhaps I should mention that the numbers I quoted were BEST CASE for the ALP, its not inconceivable that they only have 29 senators….any comments? Its certainly not something I would wish to see given the large legislative amendments needed to get some of the ALP’s platform inplemented.
I definately see an obstructive Senate looming and it concerns me.
AJ
Just watched an old bit from the Australian version of Top Model.
Apparently even models hate John Howard.
Turn down the sound. Just look at Howard’s facial expression on the 7.30 Report. You can just tell it’s all over.
Flash @ 282, agree – and they’re still discussing IR, past and present, and facts and figures – 10 minutes into it. Blah Blah Blah Blah…
Ferk! He’s losing the plot – I hope you guys are watching
He has no idea
updates of the rodnet interview would be greatly appreciated by those of us up north that acknowledge the true time of day… not some time made up by humans merely dividing the day into equal parts. who has heard of such nonsense!
Yes but, no but, yes but, no but, yes but…
Hang on, hang on hang on hang on….
Kerry could I suggest that’s the past….
On 730 Report, O’Brien is tearing Howard a new one…BIG TIME, tune in, Howard’s flumoxed,
its sounds like Vicki Pollard is being interviewed!
This is tough enough to follow for the informed.
We’re down to a fraction of university educated economists at the moment….
middle man, Kerry is calling on Howard’s comparisons with the (Labor) past and getting him to explain how he argues Labor will be bad for the economy. The beauty of this is that he has now wasted 15 minutes discussing the one issue that is political poison for the coalition… IR.
I’m a faithful Labor voter of 30+ years, and I’m still nervous about whether Labor can win. I just don’t have faith in the Australian people. In 2001, the support for Howards actions over Tampa were overwhelming. The letters of support arriving in Canberra were in floods! Letters proposing that the Australian army should go over and shoot the bastards *before* they get on leaky fishing boats etc. Race riots on Cronulla beach with hundreds of skinhead thugs wrapped “proudly” in the flag? (The next generation of “honorable” ANZACs??) The total shrugging off of military intervention in the NT? An indigenous community lodges a High Court challenge to question the legality under the federal Consititution…and most Aussies, just don’t give a flying &*^&% as long as they get their pork. Face it, a majority of Aussies are a**holes.
The total annihilation of State govts through fiscal punishment, ie withdrawing funding. (No wonder they are in debt) In Tassie, the Mersey hospital, and to a lesser extent the mill, are State govt matters, and wouldn’t have been national dramas if those electorates weren’t so important to the feds. Personally, I’m sick to death of hearing about Tasmania’s “issues” every election campaign.
The Intervention in the NT should have been a federal issue. for all Aussies because of questions about using federal powers of national military, federal police and federal powers over welfare quarantining, as a tool of discrimination on one segment of the population in one territory. The Coalition say they will extend these powers nationwide, and *NOBODY* blinks an eye — as long as they get their pork. I genuinely hope that Rudd’s careful campaigning of trying to appeal as a credible alternative to that huge demographic of a***holes works, but I’m not sure.
Knowing Labor’s bad luck, will get in with a small majority and face a freaking hostile Senate and a feral Opposition playing sabotage. I wouldn’t put it past them to stage a military coup and the majority of Aussies would say “thats OK, as I long as I get my pork!”
Kerry O’Brien is confronting Howard with various measured points about both his own past performance, and the performance of the Keating government, in particular.
Howard is flailing around, barely making a serious attempt to deflect the points O’Brien is making. He seems utterly deflated, a lost man.
Kerry and Howard just hate each other. You think Kerry is thinking, “F*ck it, this is my last interview with him, I’m not even going to pretend…”
libsrok
In a comment far, far away, William did confirm that ESJ stayed true
to his word.
@288 Bonds underwear about to apply for a patent to cater for the new Howard anatomical make-up.
ooohhhh i cant wait to watch it when we catch up to the rest of the east coast!
From the electorate of Dawson, home to that model of ministerial (ex) brilliance, Deanne Kelly.
Whilst the city of Mackay is decidedly labour voting, the provincials have the lovely Deanne on an overall margin of 10+ %.
Nonetheless, you should see the amount of TV advertising tonight. It’s a blitz and she is making more promises at the moment, than she made funding (pork-barrelling) decisions, immediately prior to the last election.
Apparently we’re getting camera’s in our fair city. Her area of responsibility has obviously diminished significantly since getting the sack as a minister.
Is she running scared?
Grog Says: “Kerry and Howard just hate each other. You think Kerry is thinking, “F*ck it, this is my last interview with him, I’m not even going to pretend…”"
How sweet.
Kerry’s certainly done his home work. Howard’s not getting away with his usual bullshit.
18 minutes in… now he’s using Shamaham’s words against the Rodent…
301 George. That is just beautiful!!!!!!!!!
I’ve got to say that Kerry is also revealing some of his own flaws – he’s incredibly well briefed tonight – why doesn’t he do this on a regular basis?
Kerry deals up Shamaham alam alam and JWH in the one question – a bit too cut and Howard walks around it.
Back to the detail Kez
Howard: “there’s no such thing as changing the Government without changing the circumstances of the country”
Amen to that, rodent
Pessimism comes with being a Labor voter.
Keryy is (by proxy for PJK) doing him SLOWLY
Howard: “if we lose the House, we wont control the senate”
And that’s bad because….?
21 Minutes in – Nuclear Power
Oh drop the bomb on the bomb!
207,
Derek, thanks for that
That gives me some kind of perspective. This election was one of the reasons I wanted to make sure I had my citizenship behind me so I could add my vote into the lot 
Howard: “Let’s have an adult debate about climate change”
It’s called “Global Warming” and it’s happening in your head as you speak…
I believe Howard has already written his concession speech for he knows he is cactus. Based on the 7:30 Report performance he is mentally deflated as the reality has set in. .
Geez I hope Rudd is on his game tomorrow night.
I’ve changed my assesment on Wentworth.
If the Libs are getting this desperate to save the seat, Malcolm may indeed by in trouble!
Gloria agreeing with Flint that the Media is soft on Rudd.
http://livenews.com.au/Articles/2007/11/20/Media_complicit_in_Rudds_spin
23 minutes in – Howard’s “education revolution” – although Howard doesn’t like Kerry using the term “revolution”… “I was being ironic” he says
Howard: Kevin Rudd’s Union “Masters” in the union
Wow, we’ve gone from “Bosses” to “Masters”… of the Universe?
Kerry has done a job on Howard tonight.
Kezza’s roasting him. Now he’s saying the “education revolution” he proposed in the debate was an attempt at irony.
Loser.
316. that is priceless.
I just checked portlandbet. Not only has Corangamite moved to the Labor column at $1.82/$1.90 but there has also been significant firming for Labor in Cowper, Robertson, Page, La Trobe, Hasluck, Swan, Dawson and Dickson. Eden-Monaro now at $1.14. I noticed that Bennelong went back out to $2.40 earlier. Back in to $2.32 now. Wentworth eased back to $2.40. The Corangamite and La Trobe prices were the ones that stood out to me.
25 minutes in: The MILLIONS spent on advertising; Kerry: “staggering
amount”
I don’t think any of this interview will move votes one way or the other. Howard has become very boring and tiresome these days.
He really looks resigned and deflated, too.
Howard: “Judge ud by the central things you judge a government by”
Kerry: “I would have thought ethics was central?”
William – slight fixup for HOR guide. You’ve mixed the candidate list for the New England and Newcastle electorates. What an interesting prospect it is seeing the bold sitting MP Tony Windsor for Newcastle. Now that’ll get those country folk scratching there heads.
Also, in the listing of all the seats in your pendulum – under reference note 6 – you have the margin for Indep over Nationals with the name Bob Katter- and not Tony Windsor. 
Just thought that might help.
27 minutes: “Why did you ask the advice of Downer and Cabinet on whether you should leave and then not take their advice”
OH THE HUMANITY!
i’ve just ordered my favourite pizza and will be settling into to watch the roasting when it comes on in Bris.
28 minutes in: “What if you lose your seat on Saturday”
Oh, PLEASE, make it stop!!!!!
EtP 321
Something is obviously brewing in Victoria, despite the already high (relatively) Labor vote.
JHO ’s head getting red
Kerry will give it to Rudd tomorrow as well. The best journalist in the country by a mile.
Howard mean and sneaky, full of contradictions, hypocrisy and lies, a pathetic human being, who undoubtedly has been our worst Prime Minister since Bruce.
Ed – there will be a tsunami in Victoria. Labor is playing it down. But it will happen – McEwen, Latrobe, McMillan, Corrangamite, Aston – and watch out for Goldstein ( it will be the sleeper – and that’s one of the reasons Robb was out there tonight on Labors candidates:profile)
Kerry went for the Kill!
Howard down for the count….1..2..3..4..5..6..7..8..9…
Kerry: “are you telling me MR Howard when your head hits the pillow at night, that you are not contemplating a possible loss”
I’m breaking down.. I can’t take it anymore…
George are you making this up? the ethics line is top shelf.
“my focus is my focus”
“you only change if you believe change is for the better”
Howard is Mr Yesterday, These lame responses where he has contradicted himself, did NOT rule out or ducked the question of Nukes, and changed history to suit himself, including disputing keatings enterprise bargaining revolution.
Sad
Pathetic,
Yesterday,
Never was.
“It’s not like getting a Christmas present you don’t like and returning it…”
Yeah. It ain’t. You’re the worst Christmas present I’ve ever had.
“My focus is…”
Myself. It always has been rattus cuneiformitus.
No-one listens to Kerry, the ABC 7.30 report is CB radio for political junkies like us, it matters not
What is it with the dyed Eyebrows?
Kerry: “Thank you sincerely for making yourself available as often as you have”
Classy Kerry, very classy.
When does the transcript or video of 7.30 Report go up online ?
He is defeated, body language, language, voice.
Howard is defeated and he knows it.
Think he will lose it and cry out “Mr Speaker Mr Speaker” if Kerry keeps pushing.
middle man Says: “George are you making this up? the ethics line is top shelf.”
middle man, my fingers are bleeding
check later and let me know how i went with the live transcript
A touching moment at the end where O’Brien says it may be their last interview, and he thanks Howard “sincerely” for making himself available so often, even during the tough times. I can’t help thinking O’Brien is turning his mind, a little, to Rudd’s refusal to go on Insiders and what that may portend.
The Howard Government has practically wrecked the ABC, but two things survived Kerry and in a much tamer version Media Watch, hopefully Howard will go and the ABC can be rebuilt.
George. He really used the past tense “have”, and not “as often as you do”? that was pure class.
Gawd is he STILL on?? How long must the fat (or bald) lady warble???
No wonder there staking a trip down memory lane – there’s just so much baggage – I mean history to dredge up.
Is it a case of Kerry asking for Howard to come on or like Downer with Lateline he has a regular spot.
GS, it’s all over… I mean the 7:30 report…
Ohh
im getting all teary eyed after watching the end of the 7.30 report,
a touching moment in tv
That was indeed very classy by O’Brien thanking Howard for always making himself available. That is true I guess.
I guess Rudds going to get a rocket over that tomorrow.
Nevertheless, These two men, O’Brien and Howard, both knew this was their last interview in their current roles.
Tonite was history gentlemen! And Ladies!
marky marky. it was a request to have both leaders on for extended interviews, to which they both agreed. Rudd has to face to wrath tomorrow night.
Has anyone else noticed how Kev and Julia always refer to JWH as “the prime minister” or “Mr Howard” whereas John and Peter often refer to KR as “Kevin Rudd” or “Rudd”.
John Howard just committed political suicide.
I know that. I am talking about the past but of course Howard only refers to it when he wants to.
So what is Howard’s problem with a worker electing to have a union represent them?
I thought he said that was OK.
Or was it only OK last week, but not this week?
George – sorry, yes it is. But I was referring to JWH’s voice still reverberating in my head!
ViggoP. that is a deliberate strategy. research showed that the public still respected Howard but thought that he was getting a bit past it. so they reflected that by using prime minister or mr howard.
When and if it does happen how will we feel? Will we feel sorry for the rodent in the end? After his concession? If and when?
Re 236,
The Finnigans Says:
I can’t thank you enough for posting this link. That was beautiful. I have passed it onto all of my friends and family. It made me cry like I do when I watch teary eyed type feel good movies.
You think that was amusing, turn it over to SBS now and watch Insight. An audience full of ‘undecideds’ who will possibly decide the nation’s future.
Now I’m really depressed…
It’s about time that Kerry- hell anyone – questioned Howard like that on his own economic record and his criticism of Hawke and Keating. Loved the fact that Howard tried not to talk about the past because it was exposing flaws in his arguments yet Kerry kept dragging him back there on the basis that it was the Coalition that raised Labor’s record in the first place. He actually made Howard answer the questions because he was using Howard’s own words and twisting them, forcing Howard to clarify. Brilliant work K O’B. Still, it won’t sway votes one way or the other because the arguments are too complicated and can’t be explained in a 15 second add break. Howard has already won that argument with his years of rewriting the Labor economic record.
As other have said, Rudd will need to be on the ball because Kerry does like to appear balanced and is likely to go harder on Rudd to compensate for the perceived bias. If Rudd is good, it maintains the status quo but if he stuffs up, he could lose votes.
Howard can’t do it! He can’t give any government other than his own any credit for anything done in the last 100 years.
What a clown.
HAHAHAHAH what!? Enterprise bargaining wasn’t introduced by Labor?
UNBELIEVABLE! Howard has completely lost it.
Kev O’Brien IS balanced He goes for the kill no matter who you are , its a matter of his pride.
I am going to record it – could be Howard’s last interview with Kerry.
Its part II of the “I just dunno Jenny” series. Insight is usually worth a look although sometimes I feel as if I’m in company with about 200 others out in TV land. Deserves better I reckon.
Can someone on PB please help me pursue Edward St John (ESJ) on his promise to donate $100 to William if last night’s/today’s Newspoll was better than 53 TPP in ALP’s favour. It was 54-46
This morning I posted:
William: On Sunday, under Morgan phone poll 56-44 at 7.54pm I posted the following:
“William: I posted the last post on the thread that has just died or lapsed:
ESJ #562:
I’ll take you on for a $100 donation to PB so long as you promise to shut up until William confirms you’ve paid the $100. 53.00-47.00 ALP TPP = draw (and we both give William $20. ALP 53.01% TPP and you pay William $100.”
I hope he’s paid”
This is getting very dense with quotation marks and yesterday threads. Issue is that I bet $100 against this assinine self-important pompous parading poncing pratulous prick (ESJ) and he lost the bet: Newspoll 54-46. Was it a core promise to pay the gambling debt or is he just another preening troll git with the ethics of everyone else in Howard’s Liberal Party?
I’d be very pleased, since I am about to go out for the evening if someone could take up the cause. Please someone when ESJ logs on tonight throw this at him.
And as for “generic person”. WTF does this combination of clueless adjective and noun mean? Why don’t you call yourself “thick idiot”. This would at least get the sympathy vote.
Oh me! Oh my! Kerry all but blew rasberries at Howard.
My cup of happiness explodeth
70% of Labor frontbench are trade-unionists.
And 100% of the coalition frontbench are c**nts.
Where after today, where would the undecided be?
#366
I know I can’t get off the floor
I have heard some rumours about Howard possibly being in ill health. Maybe even doing a ‘Mitterand’ shortly after leaving office. Inspite of his grave misdemeanours in office, I think all commentators should contemplate this possibility. It is a measure of our humanity, how we extend the hand of compassion when approporiate. Lets face it: the guys is a politcal dead duck. Sun Tsu said, “Do not interfere with an army that is returning home. “
I thnkI would rather watch Costello pashing Howard again on Today tonite than watch those utter illbred halfwits on SBS.
Sorry Middle Man, I don’t like to be a pedant, but “have” is present tense, as is “do”. To be accurate, “have” is used here in the present perfect tense.
Kerry was effectively saying “Thank you sincerely for making yourself available as often as you have (made yourself available)”. It does not imply that the act of “making one’s self available often” has ended (though I agree it probably has!).
Past tense would be: “Thank you sincerely for making yourself available as often as you did”.
Having got that off my chest, I agree with you, and suspect it is indeed Howard’s last interview with Kerry as PM.
And I do agree that Howard has seldom shied away from facing hard interviews, though, like all pollies, he indulges on plenty of media manipulation. He understands that 7.30 Report interviews have a flow-on effect to other media. In the Howard biography (which I thought was fair and interesting), the authors make the point that Howard uses ABC current affairs program to speak directly to his troops – ministers and backbenchers. Rudd may indeed adopt this course of action if he becomes PM.
Unfortunately, Howard has failed to adapt to other kinds of media (internet, Rove, FM Radio) that speak to young voters.
Mind you, Sun Tsu also said, “Violent language and driving forward as if to
the attack are signs that he will retreat.”
ph apparantly esj was true to his word
All Howard had to do is give a TINY bit of credit to the previous government, and THEN go into his spiel.
Getting all teary eyed over Howard. Yep i bet he was over workers when he gave us workchoices. Yep also when he sold Telstra and yep when he gave to all Australians a GST.
And yep i bet Howard got teary eyed over people in detention and Mrs Rau and Mrs Solon. And the people stranded on the Tampa of the Western Australian coast, stuck without food or water in the blazing sun.
I certainly don’t get teary eyed over Howard a mean, pathetic human being.
Antonio. I’m always willing to learn. Thanks.
I wouldn’t worry Gerr, it’s going to rate as highly as a ODI between Kenya and Canada at 2.00am on a Sunday morning.
@380 marky Walburg?
Yeah, nuf said.
sorry, but my tears have told me they don’t have anytime for humans with no heart.
Constant Lurker @ 243
Quite right. Probably Arthur. What I was getting at is that Howard was the public face – the man in charge. We know know it was a con.
Hey El Nino, I will give the rodent the same compassion he extended to David Hicks.
He lost any right to sympathy a long time ago…..
He can f*** off and die for I care
Marky Mark spot on assessment – this man has completely ruined the lives of innocent people and actually used their plight to further his own career and that of his party.
I, too, will not be shedding a tear for him when he gets ousted.
# 361 Gerr Says: November 20th, 2007 at 8:09 pm
You’re kidding, right? The guy thinks nothing of demonizing helpless people, and we’re supposed to have sympathy for him?
Not a chance.
In the future, this will become known as the Howard years… the decade of hate.
hahahahaha……sbs…….he has ronald reagan disease
While I am on a roll with Sun Tsu (perhaps Kev is a student):
Howard has to take on notice when he will put legislation in parliament!?
WTF?
The Rodent King is having far too many senior moments of late. Fancy suggesting labor was not responsible for EB! What next? Labor didnt float the $ or deregulate the economy in the 80’s. Pathetic, absolutley pathetic, even by Rattys usual standards. Crikey, soon he will ask for Nelson Mandela to be released from prison.
Pi, my sentiments entirely. Howard is one reason why i am an atheist.
Pi Says: “You’re kidding, right? The guy thinks nothing of demonizing helpless people, and we’re supposed to have sympathy for him?”
Right on Pi. Amen
Julie 362. I’ll second that. And KD Lang; there’s a lady I could change my sex for.
I believe Paul Hodgson is referring to a bet he also made with ESJ in addition to yours Libsrock.
and I am so tired of polls saying how great the Libs are as economic managers.
The interest rates under Keating weren’t that bad for chrissake. Sure there were a few “losers”, (who still whinge 20 years later! Ohhh Get over it! Most of you recovered long before 96 too)
For me, I was a “winner”, 18% of $60K meant people like me could get in on the housing market, when prices went tumbling. No GST and stamp duty was peanuts!
Its not the interest rate, its the capital sum you are paying the interest on that is the problem!
Basic Year 7 maths, and do you think these idiots in the mortgage belts can add up? There sure is something wrong with the education system.
It was a global recession, other countries were much worse off, and Australia recovered quicker than most. It was short-lived, a couple of tight but not disastrous years, and the most vulnerable of society were still protected from the worst blows of it. To me thats excellent “economic management”, as a country amongst dozens of others caught up in it, we did extremely well in comparison, and the majority of Australians came through it.
It was just Keating didn’t sell himself well… wasn’t one for PR, too tactless, introverted and “cold” for the cameras, and Victorians especially, never forgave him for stabbing their golden local boy Hawkey. I must admit I was one of those, Hawke was popular, Keating wasn’t, but he was a damn good Treasurer and economic manager, through both crises in the early 80s and then around 90 etc – he did well to bring this country through with a minimum of pain, and recovering quicker than other countries.
Howard/Costello have presided over good times and sold it off, sold off various assets, the national Gold Reserves, ie robbed the treasury, and then robbed the poor and even the middle-class, with over-taxing, and there will soon be nothing left to sell! Thats where all their surpluses came from! From my pocket and my national treasury! Now they want to sell off Aboriginal land (and probably for much less than its worth, like the other assets they have sold) so they have to take $10/week off the disabled, insult the poor buggers when they ask nicely for some subsidised medicines.
As for Unions – *sheesh* No wonder Rudd has got at least the Youth vote. The Gen-Y 20-somethings wouldn’t know a Union if it bit them on the bum, they were dead 10 years before they were born, and aren’t scared of “Union bosses” – as they look very much like their current generation of employer “bosses”!
The Gen-X mortage-belters were raised on horror-stories and myths, and honestly believe things like “Unions would take my pay away”….. nothing ever stopped an employer offerring “above award” individually or collectively, and some of us oldies were in very conservative white-collar unions that wouldn’t look out of place at a Liberal Party picnic. For my generation your Union card, was like joining the NRMA/RACV – may never need it, may never use it in a lifetime, but cheap and tax-deductible “insurance” was nice to have. Unions were a part of the cultural landscape for generations, up there with vegemite.
Drives me nuts. So many Aussie voters believe the crap about this stuff.
I’ll get off my soap-box now…..
BTW, I wasn’t talking about viewing him thorugh teary eyes after his departure. I think his historical legacy should be assessed for what it was. My opinion is that history will judge him harshly, above and beyond current party politics. But for the moment the guy is just an powerless and possibly ill old man. I won’t roll an old guy for his wallet no matter what his politics are.
Paul Hodgson wrote:
William has already confirmed that the payment has been made.
http://blogs.crikey.com.au/pollbludger/729?cp=4#comment-88690
No, I’m not Edward’s secretary: just wanting to thwart an unwarranted
lynching.
Ah just roll on E-day. Vote early and often, then backyard bbq, beer(s), ABC tv on in the background and the laptop bookmarked to PB in case it all gets too confoosin…
Re: 7.30 Report:
O’Brien chopped him into little pieces and fed them to the studio dog. I have never ever seen such a demolition of an experienced public figure in my life. Costello would have loved it now that he and others in the Liberal party can see that the game is up. The Rodent has been trapped and killed off. All that remains is for the public to throw his carcass into the political dust bin on Saturday.
Yes, that was very touching at the end of 7.30pm. I’d never imagine I would feel a little sorry for Howard, sad even.
What was I thinking?!
The Australian 21st of November 2007
MY FOCUS IS MY FOCUS: HOWARD
I remember when Fraser started balling in 1983 and felt nothing but glee after his role in the bloodless coup of 1975. I hope Howard drowns in his own tears. He has debased the body politic like no one else has in the countrys history.
‘What profiteth a man should he gain the whole world but lose his soul’? That was written for Howard.
Rain, you probably remember as well as I do, the shocking behaviour of the MSM under Keating.
El Nino your sympathy for El rodent is misplaced.
Make no mistake. He would roll you for a vote.
I’m with you Pi
Good evening comrades!
Has someone been taking my name in vain?
Yes I agree that I begin to feel sorry for Howard, to sense the human dimension. He is now an elderly man, still in fairly good health as far as we know, whose life work is about to be pulverised, in effect. He will face long, lonely months ahead once he quits Parliament, which he surely will within weeks of the election. He will be haunted by “what ifs”, most notably conversations with Peter Costello which will no doubt get a public airing.
On the important newspoll(?) scientific issue of
‘Which leader is what breed of dog?’
Howard – Shit-tzu. (sure, it’s obvious now)
Rudd – Labra-doodle, with a tiny bit of Qld blue heeler that snuck in.
Latham – a beautiful little rottie, smiling up at you, tail wagging, and the neighbour’s dead cat in its mouth.
GEEZUZ the ABC just previewed Rudds interview tomorrow night on 730report and finished with Rudd seemingly giving a heil hitler!
Steve K @ 401
Didn’t come across as a “demolition” to me, so could you please elaborate on which questions you think made O’Brien’s interview so terrible for Howard.
kerry sunk the blade in then twisted it then thank him generously at the end. he must of loved that one
It should have happened in ‘98, Flash, when people first realized just what he stood for.
C’mon Gerr!! pull yourself together man!!!!
chris, I loved that bit at the end. Come this Sunday, I’ll still have a job, you won’t.
Excellent
I hate corrections
and I meant
Latham – beautiful little STAFFIE, smiling up at you, tail wagging, and the neighbour’s dead cat in its mouth.
388
Pi Says:
November 20th, 2007 at 8:20 pm
“……
In the future, this will become known as the Howard years… the decade of hate.”
Pi, I’ve said before we must be two halves of the same wit! Let’s hope the next few years are known as “The Ruddy Good Times”
People should realise what the two parties stand for not the person. But of course people are stupid, and Australia is full of dills, just think people voting in 1998 to get screwed by a GST, and letting them get away with it in 2001, a country full of dumbos.
Can someone please tell me if Channel 7’s Mark Riley and Channel 9’s Laurie Oakes mentioned Andrew Robb’s 13 Labor MP hitlist on their election coverage tonight?. I saw the Channel 10 coverage with Paul Bongiorno, featuring Penny Wong.
What constitutes a landslide? How many seats have to be won to be so labeled ? How big should the swing be?
I am told that Paul Hodgson is actually Paul Case son of Ken Case so i guess that explains the vulgar abuse at 370.
The caravans moved on buddy!
@416
I just looked into Howard’s eyes on tv and all of the sudden I wanted a Mcmansion, a 40 foot HDtv widescreen , a ford territory, a vacation, another vacation, I wanted to hire a u boat and torpedo some SEIVS, and then machine gun the ppl in the water….I wanted to open up detention cetners in my back yard, I wanted to viliify dirty dirty foreigners dirty dirty dirty un australian foreigners! I wanted to turn on all my applainces and warm the planet so we could all walk round in bikinis…I JUST WANTED TO BE LOVED!!!!!!
Some body Help me!
Re 370,
Paul Hodgson Says:
Paul, he did make good. William posted that earlier today.
laurie oakes no
JFC what kind of dog would penny wong be?
A. Irish WolfHound
John Howard said on the 7.30 Report… you can’t learn from a book. WTF?!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!
esj.im glad to see you lived up to your side of our bet .in the intrest of fairness i will throw in $100 to william if ruddy wins on saturday.i think that is fair
Luke Channel 9 didn’t mention it – it was all about the work choices II
IC Moore @ 339 Around 750,000 watch Kerry every night. More bullshit from Howardistas. They’re swimming in it.
cheers,
Alan H
Watch Howard spin this.
http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2007/11/20/2096342.htm?section=justin
For those excited by the Rudd Sun Tsu video, I do question the use of a Leonard Cohen song for political purposes. As we all know, Leonard Cohen prefers to be used for sexual purposes (even in his Buddhist phase).
But if people insist on linking Leonard with Kevin, try this quote:
“And you want to travel with him, and you want to travel blind, And you think maybe you’ll trust him, For he’s touched your perfect body with his mind” (Suzanne)
And for John Howard:
“His body is gone, but back here on the lawn, his spirit continues to drool”
(One of Us Can Not Be Wrong)
Take of the dog and women comments please.
Howard held his own with Kerry. Of more interest is whether Rudd will replicate a similar performance without trotting through the same old clichees on working families and illusive future plans.
“428
middle man Says:
November 20th, 2007 at 8:39 pm
John Howard said on the 7.30 Report… you can’t learn from a book. WTF?!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!”
Maybe he can’t read.
If you do spare a thought for the Tampa, or the people left to drown, or the people locked up for no reason. No they were not like us, but they were people, they had mothers, fathers, children, brothers and sisters just like us.
Observer, that’s not right. An ‘office’ is by definition a public thing. A company with government contracts/outsourcing is not covered.
The only problem with the law is (a) it being hidden, in a rigid way in the Constitution, and (b) the High Court’s folly in reading the date back to the time of nomination, and including State officials, neither of which make sense of the purpose of protecting conflicts of interest involving Federal MPs.
Yes, I sure do mad cow @406 –
I also remember 1975, though I was tad a too young to vote, and how quickly the masses can be so manipulated.
This election is the first time since 83 I have felt optimistic, and I am proud of the ALP for not stooping to their level, not going so low as the right-wing have.
When Fraser spoke up for the Tampa reffos in 2001, I was stunned – you have to worry when Fraser feels that this current generation of Liberals are too fascist even for his taste!
Well, he made about as much sense on EBAs as certain resident commentators.
dont they teach key historical facts (and narratives) in pwivate schools? Or is it world histowee according to Downer?
@435 Generic Person
Only serious posts please.
Antonio, you missed that classic Cohen tune “Don’t let me go home with this hard on”.
Howard on 7.30 Report is just full of sh*t. He’s telling blatant lies. Changing his mind on things he’s said previously. Knob.
“What is truth?”
Herald Sun: Labor Slams ‘Desperate” Liberals
Daily T: Cocky Kev’s Crew ‘ineligible’
The Oz: Libs Flag Wentworth Legal Challenge
CM: Labor blasts ‘desperate’ Libs
Tiser: Labor’s Angry Denial
PerthNow: Ben – I want to play in 2009
“Howard held his own with Kerry”
Oh the humanity!!!!!
I just saw the best 30 minutes of political television ever. And I’ve seen years, and years… and years. After that effort from the PM, how can he honestly – honestly – stand up as a serious option for Australia on Saturday? I’ve never seen a more deflated and confused effort from Howard.
He used to be the master of deflection – but he got sucked right in! I actually felt a little embarrassed for him.
Kerry knew it wouldn’t change a vote – only people who have decided watch the program – but he just went for it, like never before.
Haha. I’m still chuckling.
No 441
Howard had Kerry around his finger.
Speaking of History.
http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=wOHfhP-38OA
435 GP
It’s a problem now to have the same message from 1 day to the next?
Look, I know Johnny and his mates can’t manage it, but if Kev can it’s a bad thing?
Held his own my (and every other Australians) ass. No – he didn’t contradict himself directly within a 10 second sound bite; he just revealed himself to be running intellectually naked.
Voters converted – minus ‘a lot’.
http://www.theage.com.au/news/federal-election-2007-news/candidate-claim-untrue/2007/11/20/1195321763222.html
Labors candidates are good.
No 448
It is possible to maintain a theme without talking in endless clichee.
One swinging voter on Insiders mentioned that they were now 99% sure they were going to vote for Rudd on the strength of his interview on Rove. Kevin knows what he’s doing.
413
Hemingway
“Didn’t come across as a “demolition” to me, so could you please elaborate on which questions you think made O’Brien’s interview so terrible for Howard.”
Try the first question and then the last – and then those in between. It was a wrecking ball experience. If you can’t see that then I suggest you watch it again on-line and the ABC site. I have no time tonight for details so I’ll leave you to your own resources.
Grog, the truth is the Libs are sunk
It’s simple…..the old coot has dementia.
No 449
That article doesn’t say that at all.
Howard on 7.30 Report … “there is no such thing as a changeless change of government” WTF?!?!?!?!?!
@446
Run’o’ the mill Generic
As long as you believe it it’s ok. Stay away from all sharp objects….and from the tone of your other posts all barnyard animals.
Goodnight Irene.
Never feel sorry for Howard – he would put you in a detention centre without blinking if it meant a bunch of votes. Don’t ever misunderstand what motivates this creature.
Of course, according to the gospel of Generic Person, we don’t actually need to wait for the ridiculous extravagance of actually hearing Rudd on the 7:30 Report tomorrow to know what it’s going to be like.
Assemble a post-mortem from the following:
“Generic”; “cliche-ridden”; “weak”; “no new policies”; “reactionary”; “same old me-tooism”; “not a serious candidate”; “lack of vision”; “creamed by Kerry”; “creamed by Howard”; “union bosses”; “can’t manage ONE TRILLION DOLLAR ECONOMY”.
You’re stuffed. Get used to it.
“It is possible to maintain a theme without talking in endless clichee.”
Yeah, agree, better than talking bullsh*t, like “Howard had Kerry around his finger.”
No 452
It was not a demolition at all. Talking in hyperbole doesn’t make your case any stronger.
It was fairly even handed and it was by no means a poor performance by Howard.
Now that we have caught up over here in Alexander “brings yer” Downer land, I must say that Kerry did a wonderful job on Howard. I thoroughly enjoyed it, especially the slow water torture (It’s not really torture of course so what’s good for the gander is good for the goose). The economic stuff would have lost some viewers, but it was worth it for the obvious pain that Kerry put the rodent through & then more, in for the kill until finally came the dry run of the concession speech when the discussion turned to the Senate & was followed by Kerry’s final epitaph – RIP dishonest John
Yep Howard was the same old Howard, mean, tricky and full of lies and rationalisations to suit his way of the world. Pity no one else asks him tough questions. Maybe Kerri Anne, Alan Jones or Neil Mitchell will work out what a question means and ask him a toughy.
Toby, it sure was great to see Kerry finally give Howard the interview he deserved knowing no longer will Howard be trying to vandalise the ABC.
I thought I’d never say this , but:
ALL HAIL THE ACTU
They have flooded the Sydney TV channels with anti-Workchoices ads, meaning that Labor ads now outnumber Lib ads by at least 2:1. This is the endgame – win this and on Saturday, victory will be ours!!!
Generic Person, I thought Howard did ok… there were no embarassments that will make for a headline or other news.
However, surely you realise they all use slogans, cliches and are repetitive. It’s how you cut through in a largely disinterested population.
It certainly makes you wonder what position Labor would be in today if they’d stuck with Beazley. Arguably of more substance, but I just don’t think he cut through.
No 460
And the bullshit about Howard being demolished? Come off it.
465 – Swing Lowe
Revealing your true “prejudices” hey?
Song – What about You’re History by Shakespeares Sister.
And what was the consensus from Insight from the undecideds.
@467
Medication time.
OTOH if their general is caught with a few of his minions, the chopping and casting of the pieces thereof to the jackals was most likely an acceptable outcome for Sun Tsu.
I’ll never feel sorry for Howard, ever, I want to see him prosecuted for crimes against humanity and war crimes right up to his last breath of his most disgraceful, reprehensible, ignominious, odious political life.
Steph: sums up this country perfectly. Gee those swinging voters are a deep thinking lot. Just like Four Corners last week, we have a bunch of dills from coast to coast.
Well comrades,
I am open to wagers on Friday’s Galaxy poll any offers?
A little less conversation a little more action comrades!
What say you?
No 466
As much as I loathe Beazley’s politics, I thought he was decent clear-cut bloke.
Rudd’s a chameleon.
…” it was by no means a poor performance by Howard”
Sure, if you’re comparing it to a one legged blind man trying to light a cigarette via a piece of hot coal rammed up his bum
kina, you’re dead right. Treat him like nuclear waste. Bury him so deep he can never return.
How can news.com.au run the headline “Election could end up in court” and expect people to take them seriously?
The tit for tat here has to stop. More importantly did anyone notice Howard’s eyebrows were quite a few shades darker than yesterday?
Oh the vanity!!!
When Kerry gracefully thanked Howard for the rabbits over the years and a good life in retirement, Howard said it is important to make yourself available because you have to be accountable.
Kerry responded by saying: Well yes but that didn’t mean you answered many of the questions.
Oh the irony!!!
Not really, ESJ – I just really REALLY want to win. How we get there is irrelevant to me…
GE says
“Of more interest is whether Rudd will replicate a similar performance without trotting through the same old clichees on working families and illusive future plans.”
I’m sure I won’t be the first to suggest that future plans are not a bad thing, or that working families deserve some consideration.
I might be the first to wonder why you’ve turned cliché feminine.
ESJ, I don’t see it being any higher than 54, no lower than 52. Now I realise that gives me a bit of wriggle room but hey.
I’ll settle for 53/47 and barely anything separating Libs/Lab on the primaries.
Re 253,
Liz Says:
Liz, I couldn’t find this. I just found an online poll where you can say how you will vote at the election. [Coming from a safe Labor seat, my electorate is to date going to elect Labor with 78% of the onlinline vote
] Can you post a link or direct me with specific directions how to find this one? Thanks 
:) ….
GP,
What are you worried about? According to you Howard is going to win all 150 seats and you’ll be drunk on Saturday night. So relax.
455 GP, sorry but, “That’s B*llsh*t”
“The Age was able to contact 10 of the 12 candidates, all of
whom said they had resigned from their Government-paid positions before nominating for Parliament.”
They said they had resigned, not “potentially”, not “maybe”, not “I’ll get back to you”, not “after the election we’ll look into it on a case by case basis”, not “my legal advice is”.
And then lets use an example:
Rob Mitchell, Labor candidate for McEwen, who was named on Mr Robb’s dossier as an adviser to Victorian Agriculture Minister Joe Helper, said he resigned on October 26 and his candidacy was lodged on October 30.
OK you can say they’re lying, but give us some proof (you know that stuff usually required before making accusations)
Howard was so humiliated that all he could do was go for the sympathy vote by speaking very softly and then looking like he was going to cry every time Kerry held him to account over a) history, b) economics c) bullshit d) anything you care to mention.
And there was a headline, in fist six months of re-elected Howard Gov the frameworks for Nukes would be put in place.
Generic Person Says:
November 20th, 2007 at 8:51 pm
No 452
“It was not a demolition at all. Talking in hyperbole doesn’t make your case any stronger.
It was fairly even handed and it was by no means a poor performance by Howard.”
It was a shockingly bad performance by Howard. He will be mortified by it for the next 48 hours which only leaves him with a further 48 hours before he delivers his farewell speech.
A song for Turnball- re last night’s 7.30 Report item.
http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=IRHA9W-zExQ
Gerr, nuclear hasn’t been an issue so far in the election and it won’t be. The nuclear reactor in your back yard scare has to be the most obvious and most lame scare… well not really… I’m still not scared of union bosses after the whole year.
Howard and O’Brien were like two old farts in a tinny, sparring about irrelevancies and reminiscences.
448 GP
I agree in principle, and as objectionable as I find the mindless talk of all politicians – apparently the ALP cliches are better than Howard’s.
Howard can’t even remember them – what will the voters thinking of on Saturday?
Here is a good rendition of the 7.30 interview
http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=kNKSzmM44gE&feature=related
Frank, I suggested ‘blue sky mining’ earlier…
the goodbye between Kez and the Rodent was class.
Lose the election
Howard all but said ‘f*ck yeah’ to putting the framework in place while he has contol of the senate. You may not be worried but I dont want nukes here.
No 486
You’re living on a different planet if you thought that was a shocking performance. But it’s to be expected from leftist zealots who would claim any Howard interview as a shocking performance.
#493
Pity Jho will have forgotten he was on the show by tomorrow morning.
GP,
No, most of us thought that JWH handled himself well in the TT interview. Not that that required much effort…
I agree Average Person ‘any Howard interview is a shocking performance.’ Also you should see someone about your fear of broccoli.
467 GP I suspect that you just may be even less intelligent than Howard. He failed General Maths at the Leaving. Rudd got the highest possible result in the equivalent examinations in Queensland. Please understand that intelligent people take your opinions with a grain of salt, in other words they realise what absolute crap they are, and ignore them. You and EStJ make a delightful pair, farting into the wind in unison. Trouble is, it all become a bit liquid, and its running down your leg.
cheers,
Alan H
The best part of the interview was the exposure of rodent’s sham claims of being a great economic reformer. He didnt have the guts to pursue deregulation under Fraser and rode on the back of Hawke and Keating’s reforms over the last ten years.
GP. i’ve alsways found that only verbose people use the word verbose, and the same goes for ‘zealots’,
456
middle man
Isn’t that why we vote for the other bloke because we want change, Howard is screwed whichever way you look at it.
Gerr, nuclear reactors will not be built in Australia until it has bipartisan support. They will not get anyone to invest in nuclear until that happens because of the large time frame it takes to set up. If the government was to change there’d be a lot of money and time lost.
I don’t want nuclear either, but I recognise it’s not an issue that is going to win votes. Otherwise the ALP would be running hard on it.
Cheesman has taken the lead in Coorangimite odds and Mcmillan is all also ahead. Deakin is 10cent difference. Go Victoria!!
No 499
LOL How intelligent you are by judging the entire record of the Government on the basis of whether Howard had the capacity to pass a general maths exam.
You’re uselessy condescending utterances are resplendent in their mediocrity.
Which site, centaur?
Ok ‘The election’ you win this time….but we’ll meet again….
Yeah look guys Generic is right. Howard performed no differently in that interview to any he has had in the last 11.5 years.
Peter Kemp @ 471: “I’ll never feel sorry for Howard, ever, I want to see him prosecuted for crimes against humanity and war crimes right up to his last breath of his most disgraceful, reprehensible, ignominious, odious political life.”
O/T, but have you encountered “The Ghost” by Robert Harris?
A thriller on that very subject, but about Blair. I’ve nearly finished it. Excellent stuff.
Gerr
Nukes have to put in place in the first six months if Howard is elected, after that he loses control of the senate. The libs only have a window of opportunity of six months but you can do a lot in six months.
Labor laid out the first 5 things they would do, what are the libs first 5 things.
1. Set the 25 Nuclear power station sites in legislation so that they cannnot be overturned without massive compensation.
2. Abolish the Fairness Test, its unworkable and is only a minor adjustment to Work Choice.
3.Renege on the hospitals deal, it is unworkable as shown with Mersey.
4.legislate on contractors, making it easier for employees to be employed as contractors rather than employees, this effectively abolishes the minimum wage.
5.Tie funding to further reform, ie states must put their workers, nurses, firies etc on Work Choices to receive funding.
Edward look at my post #429 and before I actually stuck up for you over your honoring the bet. dont carry on like a wanker now.
GP @ 505: “You’re uselessy condescending utterances are resplendent in their mediocrity.”
Oh, that we could have your effortless mastery of the English language.
@508
Geezuz another one….
they’re breeding delusions at young Lib HQ
AM. i’m with you. bring on the change!!
Yay.. Jim Arneman is down to 2.10
and.. Mike Bailey is down to 3.90
bring it on.. bring it on
The Liberal held seats in Victoria will not fall.
Unfortunately, the headlines for tomorrow will be about the 13 candidates (sigh), but hopefully more candidates can issue rebuttals. Supposedly 10 (plus Newhouse) have told The Age that their nominations are in order, with 4 (Neal in Robertson, Neumann in Blair, Parr in Hinkler and Zappia in Makin) having proof of their eligibility.
Genetic Person – http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doublethink
THATS what I said Arbie Jay but Lose the Election tried to put me straight!
Tell him!
Smartaleks.
495
Generic Person Says:
November 20th, 2007 at 9:02 pm
No 486
“You’re living on a different planet if you thought that was a shocking performance. But it’s to be expected from leftist zealots who would claim any Howard interview as a shocking performance.”
Not me old fella – I’m on planet earth. What planet are you on? Actually, I think the Rodent used to be a strong performer but due to age, campaign tiredness and the certain knowledge that he is beaten brought about tonight’s capitulation. Remove the eye patch and take another look on the ABC site.
I enjoyed the 7.30 report interview.
I particularly like the modulations in Howard’s voice when he lies. There must be some vestiges of ‘anglican’ decency remaining as his voice tends to get higher, whiny and squeaky when he goes the bareface lie. He understands this and makes a conscious effort to control the voice by lowering his voice, ’sotto voce’ almost breathless.
I said to my 18 year old mostly disengaged son, you can tell Howard is lying when his voice goes up or down to which my son added “or his lips move”.
Might have to chalk up one more ‘undecided’ for the cause
High Plains Drifter @ 516,
What evidence do you have to back yourself up on that claim?
“You’re uselessy condescending utterances are resplendent in their mediocrity.”
Lamarr: My mind is a raging torrent, flooded with rivulets of thought, cascading into a waterfall of creative alternatives.
Taggart: Gal-darnit, Mr. Lamarr, you use your tongue prettier than a 20-dollar whore.
No 521
You were sacked in 1975, get over it already.
Anyone know whats on Lateline tonite, also anyone wanna take bets on what color tie and shirt tony is wearing?
“Sportingbet” shows on.
Voter Boy you on at the moment?
Any astrologist in the house?
Howard tried to remain as positive as he could on the 7.30 report. But the poor boy blushed like a Japanese flag. I wish I didn’t have to answer questions I didn’t like in life.
So when the wife says “why did you come home at 3 last night?” I could just say “I’m not answering that”. (somehow I don’t think it will work)
Arbie Jay, if Howard wins the election he will keep control of the Senate. There will be no need to rush. In my mind it’ll be harder for them to lose the Senate than the House.
Gelatinous Person – remember it was a Lib (Brandis) that gave Howard the name ‘rodent’.
505 Generic Person Says: November 20th, 2007 at 9:05 pm
How intelligent are you by judging the suitability for Kevin Rudd to lead the country because he went to a strip joint?
Yes Siwng Lowe, but what will the slant be?
And as for the polls. Form here on in they won’t mean anything – it’s too late for any momentum to be built up. Polls that come out Saturday morning are just predictions.
The only reason polls ar eimportant is because they can frame the debate. No debate is going to be framed Saturday morning – and unless its 51-49 on Friday, they won’t mean squat.
Last night’s newspoll was the crucial one (and for proof go back and re-read the thread in the 10 minutes before sky gave them out!)
The size of the margins, the nature of the Liberal held marginals in play, the quality of the Liberal MPs, the lack of quality in the Labor candidates, and the fact that the Liberal anti union campaign bites hardest in Victoria. And tomorrow is a teachers strike.
Amazingly, Yvette Dath (one of the 13) in Petrie’s odds at Sportingbet since the allegations arose – she’s down to $1.87 from $1.95 in the afternoon.
Maybe, the bomb is already exploding…
524 Genetically modified
You know the motto:
Maintain the rage
Re 526,
centaur_007 Says:
I am probably about as close as you will get on this group. At least I own up to it.
What did you want, centaur? [I will tell you though that I don't work professionally, only for my own intersts but it goes back about 30 years]
505-Geriatric Person -did you really mean to use ‘you’re’ in that tirade ? what a waste of all those big words.
Tried to watch SBS Insiders ‘Undecideds’. WTF did they drag some of those people from, no wonder they are undecided, they seem incapable of rational thought. God save us from democracy. Loved Kezza tonight, put the old rodent on toast, he is so yesterday.
High Plains Drifter @ 531… y-a-w-n
GP 505 He can’t do basic sums. That’s why he was the worst Treasurer ever. The man is thick. Stupid people make bad decisions, hence Iraq. And Private Health Fund Tax Rebates, Childcare Tax Rebates, First Home Cash, Baby Bonuses, all of which distorted markets and drove up inflation without any real benefit to anybody. Not to mention squeezing public schools and feeding money in to stinking rich private schools, cutting funding to universities, cutting the proportion of total funding going to the states for provision of basic services. Pork barreling pointless non-projects to cronies who feed it back as donations. On and on and on. You really are just as stupid as he is! He stuffed, and you are completely irrelevant. Fart into the wind, loser.
cheers,
Alan H
HPD @ 531,
There’s a teachers strike in Victoria tomorrow??? F*ck…
Isn’t this coming from the same guy who criticised Rudd over forgetting a tax rate?
No 529
I don’t recall criticising Mr Rudd’s suitability to lead the country on the basis of his sexual affairs in foreign countries.
Re the 7:30 report Howard was just sad and pathetic. I had to keep reminding myself that I hated the guy and resist the feeling that Kerry really should just offer him a blanket and a cup of tea. Either he’s a couple of milligrams too dosed up on his valium or he’s in the early stages of depression. Whatever the guy looked for all the world like what he is and always has been – a weak, pathetic old man…I wish him every misery on saturday night.
Interesting to see again how rodent (through his little Robb-ot is) is once again prepared to trash the democratic process to maintain power – this time by politicising the AEC. Has anyone noticed any troop movements in preparation for the coup? Australia can only be the better for the passing of this sleazy demagogue.
More Labor “proof” (geez they just lie and lie and lie, praise be for one defiant MP in Andrew Robb who stands up for justice and the law)
http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2007/11/20/2096329.htm
Yes there is a teachers strike but all schools are open
#509 Lomandra. Wasn’t aware of that one, but I’ll attend to it’s acquisition, soon.
526
centaur_007 Says:
November 20th, 2007 at 9:11 pm
“Sportingbet” shows on.
Voter Boy you on at the moment?
I am indeed. Desperately waiting for the ABC to post that interview, but in the meantime enjoying watching GP, ESJ, et al, wriggle and squeal like stuck pigs.
(Having said that, all power to your elbow, ESJ, for coughing up.)
Kerry. So kind.
‘O that Friday near Christmas as I well recall
When we went to the Charity Matinee Ball,
The floor was so smooth and the band was so loud
And Johnny so handsome I felt so proud;
‘Squeeze me tighter, dear Johnny, let’s dance till it’s day’:
But he frowned like thunder and he went away’.
Auden.
I think maths ability is as good a measure as any other, as someone who has no trouble with maths and a lot of trouble with English and long ago concluded Howard contribution to this country are best forgotten.
GP @ 505: “You’re uselessy condescending utterances are resplendent in their mediocrity.”
Is that English Language or is it just bile? It certainly isn’t Aussie. Are you a Pommy? Who talks like that in Oz?
GP are you perhaps le Ministre des Affaires Etrangères Lord Dolly Downer in drag?
Mad Cow: Labor is going to win Paterson. The swing is on mate!
I heard from a reliable source today that there’s an 8.5% swing to Labor in Western Sydney. Parramatta, Macquarie and Lindsay are already in the bag for Rudd, and Macarthur & Greenway are under threat.
As a dog lover I have to say: What a wonderful image! Not that I don’t love cats too… all God’s Creatures and all that… but a perfectly chosen set of words nevertheless.
As for Howard’s Nuclear Priority in the first 8 months of power… forget about actual, physical power stations. What he’ll do is set up an enrichment and waste disposal infrastructure, AND will sign binding contracts.
Never forget: we will never build nuclear power stations. Howard – more accurately: Howard’s cronies – only want to enrich and dispose of the waste afterwards. Power stations are the Trojan Horse… far too much trouble for the “dig a hole and flog it off” economy. Enrichment and Waste Disposal are the gold.
How can Jetstar be offering 5 cent fairs for winter next year? Don’t they know there’s going to be pilot strikes round the clock??
What polls are due between now and friday. Jeez, I think I’ve become a poll junkie – I just need a 53-55 2pp to tide me over otherwise ize get the shakes
92.7 hours until the count starts
Grog @ 544,
So Mitchell in McEwen seems to be in the clear as well… Now all we need are the documents to be released and it’s all over for the Libs.
469 HH
Great song choice, its added to the list. If I get enough of this kind of quality response I’ll repost the list on Friday.
Robb, I think you’ll find plenty of your candidates wont be eligible for parliament after Saturday.
Is Andrew Robb on medication or something stronger, when he talks it is if he is out of it.
got a mate in Caloundra (Lib seat with a 13% margin) who just got a personal message from little Johnny on his home phone – the big telcos must just love the rodent’s largesse
Andrew Robb wins the dunce award. What’s the margin in Goldstein?
Song choice for Howard: “Don’t Let the Sun Go Down on Me” by Elton John.
Gerr 525 – Tony will be wearing that blue floral number – safe bet, he wears it 4 nights a week.
Is there a link to the 730 interview anywhere?
BTW, fellow bludgers, is there a Neilsen tomorrow?
I have been beseiged with Liberal stuff in my letter box in the last couple of days
And I’m in Greenway
I think that they have got some internal polling that has spooked them…..
Are you guys prepared to give Howard credit for anything? He has been the PM for the last 11 years….it didnt happen by accident. Even I am prepared to say that Rudd (of whom im not a fan) has performed quite well in this campaign. Yet you lot are so blinded by Howard hate and so one sided with your views that at times logic seems to go “out the back door”.
HPD 351
Teachers strike has strong support from the community (there’s clear evidence of this – ask the teachers). It’s not going to hurt Labor.
All this phishing by Andrew Robb! How are we absolutely sure no candidate has dual citizenship like Jackie Kelly had? Are we going to ask every candidate to prove the only citizenship he /she has is Australian.
We saw an obit tonight on the 7.30 Report. End of an era. Howard knew it, so did Kerry. An interview for the archive.
Have to see the transcript to be accurate, but the killer line was from Kerry: “I would have thought ethics … comes into it … “
Gerr
Forgot to add to Howards list.
6. Legislate the Nuclear waste dumps in the Northern Territory.
On the Nuclear Stations Howard has to move fast, the nuclear waste sites are already identified in the Territory, that is why the surveyors had GPS with them in the “intervention”.
On the 25 Nuclear Stations, they are also probably identified, commonwelath land will be the sites where the states can’t challenge the location, which is what the audit of surplus commonwealth land was about. Other prime sites the commonwealth will acquire them from business, such as the oil refinery sites in Kingston and Kurnell.
As for the time frame, the legislation will lock in massive compensation deals if the companies bidding for the sites are not allowed to proceed. This forestalls any future overturning of the sites a Nuke Stations.
Once the sites and compensation deal is locked in by legislation the Libs can then sell them to the highest and preffered bidder, but the seeling of the sites can be done anytime within the next three years.
Derek mine was Howard saying “you cant learn from books”. F8ckin brilliant!
ABC is a dream team on election night, Greeney Obrien and TJ, with Gillard ….and mingin minchin….ah well cant have allstars on every line.
My politics are well known on this site – I am no fan of Howard – but he was fine on 7.30 – the usual stuff but he came across OK
Thommo: gun laws.
In 15 years’ time, Australians will look back at Howard and say, “How on earth did we elect that man Prime Minister? AND do it four times?”
568 – yes, that was a good line. It’s a shame Kerry didn’t press that line of question – then he may have had Johnnie on the ropes
@565 Dear Thommo.
No.
Thank you for your enquiry.
Don’t call us…we’ll call you.
Thommo. I’m willing to concede that Howard has, up until this campaign, been a fantastic politician in its truest sense. But as a human being he is a failure.
Thommo,
I’ll grant you that Howard has done some good things:
1. Gun control
2. East Timor
3. Post-Tsunami Aid
4. GST (half marks for this, as he’s introduced way too much red-tape with this)
5. Afghanistan (I know I’ll probably get heckled on this one, but it’s a just war)
Other than that, there’s not much there to endear him. Plus one can compile a much bigger list of things that have stuffed up Australia…
Looking forward to watching the 7.30 report here in the wild west.
Received not one but two letters today from Liberal Barry Haase. Plus the letter from the bank about the interest rate rise. Hmm… Maybe time to consider re-financing…
I think that makes three letters in three days from Barry. I don’t know why he writes to me. At least the bank was just politely letting me know that I’ll need an extra thirty or forty bucks in the account when they take out my next payment on Friday night. Which reminds me, I need to tighten the cash flow a bit…
I gather that Barry is in Halls Creek tonight. He must be looking for an Indigenous wedge to play.
{Are you guys prepared to give Howard credit for anything?}
Not really Thommo. There’s Biblical precedent for it, the parable of the talents–the person who buried the money as I recall. “What little you have will be taken away”
Ugggh I hope Tony Jones is away from the main panel and in some other broadcasting area on election night. Most over rated journalist ever.
Thomo @ 565 – “I am prepared to say that Rudd (of whom im not a fan) has performed quite well in this campaign”. In that comment I read landslide…
Stopt the press Bobby Brown is giving a performance on SBS.
Thommo
Ummm….Nup, can’t think of a single thing – Oh, I thank him for making such a fool of costello- probably his most significant achievement as PM.
Right now.
Remember this? I am telling you he aint “right’
http://youtube.com/watch?v=7M34_x4aNFs
Thommo,
Not true. I have always liked Howard’s curly hair.
Thommo.
Here’s my credit to Howard for the last 11 years:
Gun laws.
East Timor.
GST (yes I just wish Keating hadn’t been rolled on it by Hawke)
That’s it.
But in this campaign. I’m sorry he has been woeful. It’s not all his fault, it’s just he has gone back to the same well once too often. We all knew it was going to happen – hell even his cabinet knew it was going to happen.
VBOW what news from the bunker?
Julie resident astrologer what kind of days will Virgos have and of course Leo’s on the 24th.
George we still on for lunch tomorrow at 1pm?
No 576
Mr Hunt, the resident dunce, is scrambling around for ideas it seems.
Go Bob Brown! Go Greens! yay… I dont even vote for ‘em, but I like their ads
… and from some of the posts on this site, are you guys and polly gurus telling me, that in order for Labor to win this time, we might have to depend on small-l liberal Liberal voters in safe Liberal seats?
You mean to tell me honestly — there are a bunch of Frazer-types who’ve a “born-agains” out there in Liberal heartland, willing to switch sides because they think Howard and his front-bench-henchmen are a***holes and giving the Liberal Party a ‘bad name”?
Gawd help us, the irony, of having “wet” Liberals switch sides…
that must really *hurt* Mr Howard…
And for the record, Swing Lowe and I are not the same person!
Its ok, its safe again Bobby finished saving us from ourselves….;)
God bless him.
Quick question for anybody
Is it fine for me to wear my Kevin07 shirt into the polling booth to vote?
I though it was as long as your not openly campaigning and not a candidate. The info sheet given to me on how to hand out how to vote cards says I cant.
any body know for sure.
thanks
I do like the line about third party insurance
Grog @ 592,
Damn straight.
Gee I go away for a moment and there’s a few extra hundred comments, and Rattus Rattus has been into the Ratsak! He obviously didn’t read that article or read this blog.
SO…..
It’s a nice strong base, with some big swings expected… some Liberals will get a VERY BIG shock. But probably just as you thought:
Queensland looks good,
NSW is strong,
Vic nyyaaahhh,
WA might be better than expected,
Tas is in the bag,
SA good things come to those who wait.
Very confident.
PS: Some numbers where mentioned, and seats, and maybe some people here are very close.
Id hate to say this, BUT I would have preferred Hewson to have beaten Keating in 1993 than Howard win one election.
You are not being honest with yourself if you hold that Howard has been good for this country.
Its getting close now, a Labor government with the Greens holding the BOP in the Senate sounds great, I cant wait till saturday.
Led Zeppelin reforms! It’s a great omen!
1)GST, as we move to a service economy we needed a tax that taxed services before manufacturing was destroyed.
2)Dealing with the wharfs, fortunately he legal profession prevented it from going to far.
3)Gun control.
Unfortunately none of that will compensate for destroying the Liberal party in a blind attempt at destroying the Labor party (which is all work choices was) and his destruction of our international reputation ( which is all Tampa and all the other nonsense did).
centaur_007 Says: “George we still on for lunch tomorrow at 1pm?”
Absolutely mate – looking forward to it! I am working from home, so no-one can hassle me from the office.
Hossen27. seems you’d need to make a clear distinction between your personal act of voting, and political act of handing out HTV cards. maybe walk to the next booth to vote?
Oh, By the way, David Hobson got voted off Dancing with the Stars. That’s the election most people are caring about tonight.
Oh to be “most people” again! 4 more days!!!
565 – No one is entitled to credit for just being there a long time, otherwise we could have had a toillet door for PM for the last decade (might have been more successful). Its about opportunity cost – what might have been achieved while rodent was busy wasting opportunities wedging and deceiving his way to 11 years of ‘just being there’. Apart from the gun laws I cant see anything positive.
I mean re-forms. They’re still taking drugs
Hossen the general public are exempt but if you’re handing out HTV cards then no!
Grog – 606 – yes
*sigh*
It’s been 11 years, but to lose this obsession will be quite something.
I reckon I’ll feel quite empty for a while – nothing to wish for.
I just saw the worst political advert for many a year, for The Greens.
Two Bob Browns – as it one of him isn’t bad enough. And that desplorable gingle ‘Take Action; Green Action !”
Boring Bob then starts with the first lie “There is no real difference between Liberal and Labor”. Why, then, are The Greens preferencing Labor ?
Can they identify one policy that’s not copied from the Democrats ? While they’re always going to take action, they never achieve anything.
589,
Centaur, will take that under advisement and get back to you tomorrow sometime. I have birth data so can run it through my astrolog program and check transits. I don’t know birth times though so my information isn’t complete and I might therefore miss an important detail. I will check and see though with the limits of what I know. Btw, just checking Sun Signs will not turn the trick, you need the check the whole horoscope. Look for an answer sometime tomorrow. Heading off now to watch Spears <god help me I am a news tragic and I have to watch ….. .
I hope William does a d-day -3 tomorrow, and so on and son on…he should dramatize just a little, maybe pretend he’s like News Ltd for a little. Get some excitment into it.
GP No answer to my 538? Dodging are we, like Howard from Kerry? As I said, you and Johnny make a good pair. Thick, and losers. For the record, people who can’t do basic sums shouldn’t take on jobs they can’t do. Howard was without doubt the worst Treasurer this country ever had. He took an economy in good health and stuffed it up, leaving us a basket case. Keating and Hawke took drastic action, in concert with the ACTU, and fixed it. Howard and Costello, another anumerate dunce, have piddled the inheritance up against a wall.
cheers,
Alan H
Seriously, this will be a seat by seat fight for the last four seats for a Labor win. It will depend on how the two national campaigns play in these marginals, the make up of these seats, and the individual campaigns on the ground. In 1993, I think it was 1500 votes going in the other direction that would have made the difference.
No 603
I will go on record that I do have some criticisms of the government:
1. The USA Free trade agreement
2. Kevin Andrews
Thanks Julie it will be interesting. I wonder if we can find out what time the leaders were born. I doubt it?
New lead story on the SMH (in front of the 13 candidates):
http://www.smh.com.au/news/federal-election-2007-news/pm-appeals-to-voters/2007/11/20/1195321780546.html
Thanks guys
ill just chuck a shirt on over the top and then vote. Its not a big deal anyway.
Cheers
Charles… all that stuff was finished long long ago…
“501
middle man Says:
November 20th, 2007 at 9:04 pm
GP. i’ve alsways found that only verbose people use the word verbose, and the same goes for ‘zealots’,”
‘Verbose’ was the Chinese character with the most strokes but, the original version is now no longer used, just too many strokes.
Gerr
Hewson would have been a better PM than Howard, though god only knows how far down the neo-lib, dry economic path he would have taken us.
93 would have been bad for Labor to lose though cos the economy was just then picking up and the liberals (who we all know are just such bloody good economic managers) would have then taken credit for the whole 16 year period of growth. Hewson might be about to break Menzies record by now.
Derek Corbett Says: We saw an obit tonight on the 7.30 Report. End of an era. Howard knew it, so did Kerry. An interview for the archive.
Too Right, death warmed up, and Red Kerry spent the majority of time in he past and his sign off was positively necroplilliac.
Hossen27, bring along another t-shirt and wear over Kevin07. No need to go to another booth.
Many Australians feel disgruntled that we are becoming Americanised, and there’s nothing more American than this sort of “Swiftboating” regarding the “doubts about the eligibility” of 13 Labor candidates. Naturally, it would be grandfatherly Andrew Robb dishing the dirt in his sanctimonious voice.
However, this one will backfire like Piers Ackerman’s “Queenslandgate” allegations, Glen Milne’s “Strippergate” smear, the “Burkegate” beat-up, and ‘The Australian’ newspaper “Gillardgate” mudslinging of last week.
This latest cheap attack so near election day will not convince any voters to change abandon these 13 Labor candidates, but will harden many “soft” voters all around the country to stick with their Labor candidates because they don’t like dirty political tricks.
At the very least, this is foolishly soaking up what few precious hours and oxygen that remain for the Coalition to cut through the “deadly intent” (Peter Hartcher) of their losing position in the polls for the past year.
Paul Kavanagh @ 611
Yeah, I ‘ve got to say some of the Greens media stuff has been woeful. Looks like they’ve been getting too much advise from “free range” media experts instead of professionals. A lot of their stuff looks like it’s been put together by High School kids.
Just because Howard is going to lose, doesn’t mean we should look kindly at his dismal legacy.
I refer you to the Chaser’s eulogy song.
615 High Plains Drifter Says: November 20th, 2007 at 9:34 pm
Seriously, it won’t. It will be a landslide.
“589
centaur_007 Says:
November 20th, 2007 at 9:27 pm
VBOW what news from the bunker?”
I’ve held off ringing him. I said last week that I’d wait until Thursday before I called him back, but I succumbed. This time I’m holding tight; I think I can get more bang for my buck with a few days in between than if I have the running commentary. Also, if I wait until Thursday, he’s more likely to be able to tell me what Costello’s people thought of the 7.30 Report interview. (I’ll also need to ask what they made of the love-fest on TT)
My overall feel from last week was that their hopes were in the marginals (duh), and that they could neutralise the swing (which they acknowledge is real) with some clever laser targetting. Unfortunately, I don’t know enough about seat-by-seat politics to know whether that’s do-able. But the general feeling was that Howard has had a lousy campaign. What’s interesting, though, is that the Howard loyalists recognise this, but still blame Costello.
MIchael @ 595 – I have been looking for good slogan I can use on polling day. I am handing out HTV for the Greens on polling day (although I don’t think I am voting for them in HoR – the hoplessly complex post modern small-l liberal amatuer pseph that I am).
@622
Yeah but theres a knockdown argument to your point.
We wouldn’t have had Howard.
Nuff said.
Im pro ALP but would concievable give my ‘preferences’ to a Turnbull or a decent Hewson (as he turned out to be).
It’s not hatred of Howard for Howards sake per se, Its’ just everything he’s done and everything he’s said.
That’s all.
It’s ok GP. No need to be ashamed about your emotional state.
No need to worry.
It is just a stage you are going through.
Just hang in there mate and you will come through.
They all do in the end, even some Libs:
Shock stage: Initial paralysis at hearing the bad news.
Denial stage: Trying to avoid the inevitable.
Anger stage: Frustrated outpouring of bottled-up emotion.
Bargaining stage: Seeking in vain for a way out.
Depression stage: Final realization of the inevitable.
Testing stage: Seeking realistic solutions.
Acceptance stage: Finally finding the way forward.
Mad cow et al – Popping back in to follow up a completely different topic left over from last night: I found some decent figures about permanent departures from Australia at http://www.immi.gov.au/media/fact-sheets/05emigration_1.htm
Definitely worth a look, though the series ends in 2006. Here are annual figs for the Australian-born who’ve been voting with their feet (and mostly not voting thereafter):
Aust’s departing permanently Total departures as % of arrivals
1995-96 11 005 28.90%
1996-97 11 698 34.80%
1997-98 12 771 41.40%
1998-99 17 250 41.80%
1999-2000 20 234 44.50%
2000-01 23 081 43.30%
2001-02 24 146 54.30%
2002-03 25 578 53.70%
2003-04 29 140 52.94%
2004-05 31 027 50.72%
2005-06 34 284 51.56%
If my sums are right, that’s just over 240K in a bit more than a decade.
After the commercial break, Abbott is the guest on Spears show tonight …. wonder if we will see him put both feet into his mouth tonight? ….. stay tuned ….
Looking at the News Ltd website readership numbers, it’s interesting that Labor’s denials are getting more hits than the original (13 candidates) stories.
Maybe this is running out of puff faster than I thought…
No El nino Im tipping the Government to hang in.
Paul Kavanagh
Whats your idea of political excitement and substance? The greens are the party or real integrity and everyone who still has a commitment to truly progressive politics knows it.
Julie @ 630,
Abbott was Speers’ guest for the 4:15 show. My guess is that they’re just repeating the same interview.
Libsrok thanks for the “defence”.
I am interested in other wagers – principally because for all of the bravado on this site few are willing to back up that bravado with their green. I dont think that is being a wanker.
I find it interesting the reaction of some to the looming Rudd victory, there seem to be a few common themes
1) Intoxication – suggests an inability to be happy without alcohol which is worrying given the high rate of alcohol related illnesses and deaths in our society (much more harmful than drugs)
2) Abuse and body function references (Alan H & ShowsOn)
3) Mindless me-tooism of the line yah labor will win variety
The most interesting development of today was Combet’s interview in the Financial Review. The cynicism is amazing, someone who fed from the union trough, gets in to parliament and weeks later has dumped the unions and is talking about “individual rights”, must make some of you union hacks v.sad at the level of treachery.
At least with Howard he has always authentically hated the unions.
A621 Siev.
Yes thinking of it like that, that was what behind Kerrys questions. The questions reflected the questioning of an entire career and legacy rather than right here right now. However it was framed in the terms of the Libs advertising which gave it a nice angle.
It was a historic interview.
Coalitions new approach:
When you can’t win democratically… CHEAT
This is the most pathetic thing I have ever seen from the Coalition
Man today’s stunt by the libs really was a new low, are they going to want a recount next when they lose?
It’s backfired of course since everyone I’ve talked to thinks they came off looking a.)desperate b.)power hungry 3.)throughly unpleasant human beings.
Guess its a great way to prove the internal lib polling is as bad as we suspect it is.
561 Swing Lowe
Love it, on the list
@628
JHiaC that sounded like the phases of the rodents mental condition as Bluey O’Brien finally delivered the coup de grace rat sac this evening.
Speers and Abbott look like they might share a tissue in a moment.
Does anybody else think Labor is playing down their chances of a win? Some people believe Labor will win quite comfortably but the ALP are afraid to give that impression. Therefore they talk about Labor being behind in this seat and that seat according to Labor internal polling. OR is Labor being genuine and they really are behind in several marginal seats. I can’t tell if they’re playing smart politics or honest politics.
Jenny. As I said before, I’ll bet that Antony mentions the expat vote on his election shiow
@641
YES. Wouldn’t you?
629 Jenny
You are on to something there, that’s our taxation system taxing out incentive to work and our IR laws working against high pay, so many of our best and brightest go overseas.
Using a Senate cut-up on the average of the tear’s Senate polls, the following results emerage
Likely 2007 electon result
LNP ALP DEM GRN FFIRST IND TOTAL
NSW 2 3 0 1 0 0 6
VIC 2 3 0 1 0 0 6
QLD 3 2 1 0 0 0 6
WA 3 2 0 1 0 0 6
SA 2 2 0 1 0 1 6
TAS 2 3 0 1 0 0 6
NT 1 1 0 0 0 0 2
ACT 1 1 0 0 0 0 2
Total won 2007
16 17 1 5 0 1 40
Post election 2007
LNP ALP DEM GRN FFIRST IND TOTAL
NSW 5 6 0 1 0 0 12
VIC 5 5 0 1 1 0 12
QLD 7 4 1 0 0 0 12
WA 6 4 0 2 0 0 12
SA 5 5 0 1 0 1 12
TAS 5 5 0 2 0 0 12
NT 1 1 0 0 0 0 2
ACT 1 1 0 0 0 0 2
Total seats
35 31 1 7 1 1 76
If Malcolm is right, GRN would get a seat in the ACT- this requires the LIB to drop below rge rusted-on level, fairly unlikely.
The polls, however, tend to overestimate the 3rd-party vote, though not as much as legend would have it.
Sorry. @ 642
YEs. Wouldn’t you?
{Apart from the gun laws…} A bit off topic but…
Until you see how the legislation operates as I did in Walgett last Friday. It regards anything that was capable in the past of firing a projectile ie a totally rusted out .22 with no bolt found on a property and kept as a souvenir, attracting a max 5 year penalty (same as assault occasioning actual bodily harm). I’d suggest if that had been anyone here…? Not so keen on the efficacy thereof?
Imelda marcos
“no skeletons in my closet,only shoes”
gotta love it
Luke, if Labor were really behind they’d be saying different things. Looks at the state elections at what the Oppositions said when it was clear they were behind.
Yes, Abbott is on again, but the introduction and conclusion are up-to-date.
I think the Andrew Robb stunt today was designed to get the Workchoices cover up off the evening news.
Gusface,
Has the threat of being heavied at work disappeared? I recall you left for that reason?
Just watching Abbot on Sky. Geez he looks bad. He’s unravelling. Hair is a mess and lokks like he hasn’t slept for days. Needs a shave too.
WTF is he on about regarding Health funding??
Actually, Luke, it’s a deliberate strategy to feed stooges like Shanahan (such a misappropriation of a good Irish name!) stories about ‘Oh, we can only count 14 in the bag and if Howard wins back 2 in the West then we’re cactus (etc, etc)’. So the Oz prints it and it’s ‘common wisdom’.
It will not be close, and my 10 year old daughter has asked me if she can stay up on Saturday night so she can see John Howard cry. Of course she can, but it won’t be a late night for her.
Meant to do this last night but got side tracked (apparently a poll was released)
The ratings of Rove on Sunday compared to the previous week make for interesting (ok not really but stick with me) reading:
National: 1.145m – 1.368m (19.5% increase)
Syd: 340,000 – 411,000 (20%)
Melb: 373,000 – 467,000 (25%)
Bris: 154,000 – 204,000 (32%)
Adel: 127,000 – 134,000 (5%)
Perth: 151,000 – 153,000 (1.3%)
Kavanagh,
Settle down with your anti-green pro-democrat diatribe.
It is quite embarrasing to watch you cry about the transfer of the balance of power from the dems to the greens.
I heard the dems ad on the radio today and it seemed to copy chunks of the greens ad “we’ll take action” etc…
All the dems ever wanted was to play the minor middle power. At least the greens have greater ambition than simply sitting on the fence.
ESJ. I have friends who live and work/run businesses overseas and not once has one of them mentioned tax rates or IR. That’s bogus. It’s usually the opportunity offered by larger markets, and the opportunity to earn strong currency that converts well when they eventually come home. Oh and a couple have mentioned escaping from Howard’s Oz.
Even if Labor were going to romp it in you never say that, look at Beattie in QLD, he always played the underdog card and he was up against Flegg’s Coalition who couldn’t win if they were the only name on the ballot.
So best to play the underdog, but I feel they will win very convincingly on the day.
Well, it’s all gone tremendously well, the campaign and everything. Never seen such superlative strategy, so many finely nuanced, carefully considered tactical plays, such over arching vision for the future. Yep,let’s just fling faux poo.
If Howard loses – what a wonderful world.
http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=vnRqYMTpXHc&feature=related
You have to check this quote out from the Gerard McManus’ article in the Hun regarding the 13 candidates:
Link is here:
http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/story/0,21985,22790836-661,00.html?from=mostpop
Sol Lebovic on sky: in a nuteshell, he’s basically saying “it’s all over”
The Finnigans 236
Julie 362
ViggoP 395
The Tao of Kevin Rudd. Couldn’t agree more. It says so much, so positively, so simply, brought a tear or two to my eyes as well. Makes you feel that there really can be a way forward, to an Australia to be proud of again.
And thank you, William, for this wonderful blog – I’ve been lurking for a couple of weeks and have learned a lot, not least to be very optimistic about having a joyous Saturday night!
The Libs have advisers from the Bush’s Republican Party directing aspects of their campaign. Today’s tactic on the 13 candidates is straight out of the American Right Wing playbook. It has backfired badly and cements the image of deceitfulness and reminds people of why they need to go.
Middle Man they are probably embarrased to tell you how much they are earning overseas
Re: 568 Agree with Derek Corbett.
I nearly jumped out of my litter when I heard Kerry say that.
It’s the first time in this entire campaign that I’ve heard anything in the media on the issue of basic integrity.
How come there is no discussion about AWB (first time mentioned in today’s Age), Coalition of the willing, Sieve X, Children overboard, Tampa, concentration camps, wrongful detention, and loads more that’s not top o’ mind?
Speers’s begging: “Please, Sol, tell me how Howard can get back in the game”
Thanks VB, and Julie, George I’ll see youi tomorrow. My pizza is aclling and I’ll watch latel;ine
So George and supporters, are you prepared to name all the seats in Victoria that Labor will win, and why?
Prediction time: One of Dickson, Hughes, or Higgins(!) will be the shocker.
“645
Edward StJohn Says:
November 20th, 2007 at 9:45 pm
629 Jenny
You are on to something there, that’s our taxation system taxing out incentive to work and our IR laws working against high pay, so many of our best and brightest go overseas.”
Your comment about the IR laws is nonsense, and I suspect you know it. Most of the lawyers, bankers and accountants over here in England are not affected by IR laws “working against high pay”. We were already on high pay, and yet we came to a country with a Labor Government. Most people I know left because career options are greater overseas. If there is a political aspect to this, the most I would say is that Howard and Cos have singularly failed to turn Australia into a financial hub for Asia. But I’m even cautious on that (however true it is).
However, it is certainly true that house price inflation has undermined those of us who left here in the late 90s thinking we could make a bundle and then come back quite a few steps up the property ladder…
I just wish the greens would get real. We have to move away from a carbon economy so what do we get, greens opposing wind mills and dams. They are slowing down the required changes and to top it all off they come out with half baked policies that have nothing to do with the environment, further reducing their support base.
They need to learn from Rudd, only paint the canvas in areas you really care about, let the voters paint the rest of the canvas in any manner they so chose.
Yep JackSparrow, you’re right about Beattie, at the last eleciton he almost had me convinced it was going to be close. Then on election night I remember the Liberal joker on ABC said “well it is an improvement on last time”.
He almost made it sound like a good result until the interviewer pointed out it was the second biggest beating the LNP had ever had in QLD.
No mention from Sol about the mysterious 20 % who change their mind on the day. It’ll come.
Aha there it is
Thommo @ 565
This has to be put in simple terms.
Are you aware of the John and Betty books? They were used to teach English in primary schools many, many years ago. Example: “That is a dog. That is a rat.”
So, moving to politics. “John is a rat.”
Hope that helps … cheers.
I
Luke @ 642 – Google Beattie’s comments in the run up to the 2001, 2004 and 2006 elections. They were all landslides. This stuff is join the dots in contemporary Qld politics. Perhaps Howard should have paid more attention to Beattie tactics. Then again, I am wondering if Howard is only of average intelligence and until now has relied on advice from smarter people.
Derek Corbett 677
Are you learning to read? That’s wonderful. Adult learning and improvement is a great thing.
By the sounds of it Andrew Robb will do very well in Florida.
ESJ @ 666: In Australia, under the Liberal Party, I was earning A$140,000. In Britain, under Gordon Brown’s Labour, I’m earning a minimum of A$255,479. That doesn’t include the A$2,700 my wife gets per year in family allowance.
And I still vote Labor. And Labour.
HPD,
My one definite is La Trobe (based on the betting markets).
I’ve tipped Corangamite to fall, but Deakin and McMillan will probably be lineball.
Well – David Speers has surprised me on Agenda – he appeared to present a balanced view tonight.
William. Without reading every single post on the topic v. early in thread.
At mine, I usually do, in one window, show all pages. for ongoing perusal.
Then open a new window, same thread, and refresh only the most recent page number. Especially useful for posting.
VB over the water
So for all you “insider” talk you fess up your just another speculator on the make. Why dont you try risk and enterprise and create real wealth and jobs? Why work when you can speculate hey?
“However, it is certainly true that house price inflation has undermined those of us who left here in the late 90s thinking we could make a bundle and then come back quite a few steps up the property ladder…”
Well that didn’t take long to get blown up;
PM says Nuclear power is on his agenda
http://www.smh.com.au/news/National/PM-says-Nuclear-power-is-on-his-agenda/2007/11/20/1195321781982.html
Actually good leaders surround themselves with people who are smarter than they are.
Jenny @629 – mostly youngun graduates I suspect. They’ve learned like my 20-something kids, on their backpacking tours of Europe, even USA – thats its now cheaper to get a good degree at a USA public University than it is in Australia. HECS has doubled in the last 5 years, plus has an annual interest rate charged on it.
My daughter came home afte a year in Canada, shocked at the crap starting salaries, inability to even find a job in her chosen field of study, and the total inability to undertake the cost of post-grad studies either. She flew back and the other thing, if they stay overseas – they dont pay their HECS debts!
This is what Rudd is talking about the “brain drain” has escalated in the last 5 years…
Rain, you should blame the Labor IR system for that! Its good evidence of the need for change.
VB what is the cost of living like in Britain comparatively?
From the Mad Monk.
Mr Pot, Meet Mr Kettle.
http://www.smh.com.au/news/National/Abbott-accuses-Labor-of-slush-fund/2007/11/20/1195321782887.html
I’m sorry but I have extremely bad news to report!
A person I know who when Politics is mentioned ups and leaves the room, always votes informal after arriving at the booth at approx 5:55 pm just to avoid a fine has declared she will be voting for the ALP
What won her vote you ask, first the I won’t he will ad and
WORKCHOICES this person happens to hate Unions so I ask can it get any worst.
Sorry about the bad news.
“Howard denies IR cover-up” appears under national news on the Herald Sun website.
That’s funny, I could have sworn they always used to call him “PM”. Now he’s just “Howard” again.
681 VB over the water
Your not very bright then considering the cost of living in the UK.
I think Turnbull just lost his seat.
I know we complain about some of our LNP-leaning bloggers but I saw this one on Overington’s pathetic effort (All the polls are wrong) from today. Not surprisingly, the moron was from FNQ.
“Who are all you leftwits and Labor diehards trying to convince? Yourselves? What a waste of time…if you are trying to influence voters, why not do it somewhere else? This bloggery, apart from some, appears solidly decided.
By the way, Rudd only “appears” as though he will win because that is what the popular media wants people to believe. Just look at the front page pics of The Australian the last few days – disgracefully one sided. Wake up people!! “
I’m a labor voter and a pessimist – it comes with the territory, as a couple of people here have remarked, particularly over the last 11 and a half years…
For others like me (LTEP in particular), I thought it worth sharing my memories from 97 when I was living in the UK. At the time, the national polls were good for Labour, but many of the commentators were saying it would come down to a few key seats – all the marginals were critical, and the Tories were mounting a strong rear-guard action, we were told. As it turned out, as I’m sure all of you know, Labour won over 400 seats and had a majority of nearly 250.
One can but dream…
Nice touch from Kezza saying goodbye to Mr Howard tonight. The reality. But well done.
VBOTHW Any news from the inside? Another phone call required?
523
George Says:
Ha ha ha ha ha ha. Oh fond memories.
578
Swing Lowe Says:
Thommo,
I’ll grant you that Howard has done some good things:
2. East Timor
No, no, no, no. Howard did NOT want to go into ET. He had to be dragged kicking and screaming into that one by massive public pressure, and held out as long as possible. His share of the credit is quite limited. The real heroes (in Oz) are the general public for forcing his government’s hand.
617
kina Says:
‘Verbose’ was the Chinese character with the most strokes but, the original version is now no longer used, just too many strokes.
And what about the character for zero (?, líng)? Takes forever to write.
673
charles Says:
I just wish the greens would get real. We have to move away from a carbon economy so what do we get, greens opposing wind mills and dams.
Dams are environmental nightmares, very expensive and have limited life spans. That is why dam building around the world has largely stopped.
Re the teacher’s strike.
The secret ballot process began before the election was called and I imagine it would’ve been difficult to change to a less provocative date. The response to the ballot was over 90% positive. I’m a unionist, so I’m out tomorrow. My Year 12s had their exam on Monday!
Imagine AWAs for teachers.
523
George Says:
Ha ha ha ha ha ha. Oh fond memories.
578
Swing Lowe Says:
Thommo,
I’ll grant you that Howard has done some good things:
2. East Timor
No, no, no, no. Howard did NOT want to go into ET. He had to be dragged kicking and screaming into that one by massive public pressure, and held out as long as possible. His share of the credit is quite limited. The real heroes (in Oz) are the general public for forcing his government’s hand.
617
kina Says:
‘Verbose’ was the Chinese character with the most strokes but, the original version is now no longer used, just too many strokes.
And what about the character for zero (líng)? Takes forever to write.
673
charles Says:
I just wish the greens would get real. We have to move away from a carbon economy so what do we get, greens opposing wind mills and dams.
Dams are environmental nightmares, very expensive and have limited life spans. That is why dam building around the world has largely stopped.
ESJ. if only the libs had your advice to try risk and enterprise. they may not have squandered the opportunity presented to them over the past decade.
And dont you worry i know how my friends are going and how i’m going. Only libs are embarassed when they aren’t earning as much as their friends.
Jealousy is a curse my friend and you sound positively consumed by it.
BMW of Victoria,
Fancy that! My dog has the same sentiments.
660 Harry ‘Snapper’ Organs
You still on? I found out who you are tonight! Got a song for the election night list?
What happened there? Pardon the double post.
686, Let It End, he didn’t mention about the nuclear waste dumps that he plans for the Northern Territory though, the real reason he had the land seizures there under the pretext of protecting the little children. What a lying hypocrite.
ESj
sorted (thanks for asking)
funnily enough a friend called re the Libs election timetable
me: how are you travelling
him:really shithouse -the stuff up is huge
me;yeah seems a bit disjointed and confused,i mean your tax plan first!
him:thats not the half
me:whaddyamean
him:well (long pause) sighs-some f*****t gave the timetable to H.O. to collate
me:gigling-nooo
him:yep-so apparently this week is week two and last week should been week five or maybe week one was week five.. oh F***
me:hello
me:hello
methinks the icing on the cake happened early today
Hi George, Hi ESJ, Good evening me fellow bloggers…Just 3 more days to endure our fates & faith in democracy. I’ll join you all soon:-)
ESJ @ 679
“Adult learning and improvement is a great thing.”
Way hey hey hey !!!!!!
I’ve heard these stories about the Libs, a few mates you know had to get married. But you.re so candid. Maybe a mate of Billy Big Ears.
They are fast. Don’t think it will help their cause.
“A re-elected coalition government would change the law to pave the way for nuclear power stations, Prime Minister John Howard says.
The Greens have seized on the comments, which they say will change votes in Saturday’s election.
Mr Howard said a re-elected coalition would not build nuclear power stations, but would move during the next term of government to remove laws that stop them being built.”
“#674
Grog Says:
November 20th, 2007 at 9:54 pm
Yep JackSparrow, you’re right about Beattie, at the last eleciton he almost had me convinced it was going to be close. Then on election night I remember the Liberal joker on ABC said “well it is an improvement on last time”.
He almost made it sound like a good result until the interviewer pointed out it was the second biggest beating the LNP had ever had in QLD.”
If you live in Queensland and thought the last State election would be close, you are an idiot.
The opposition in Queensland is non-existant. I can’t even remember the opposition leaders name(it changes so much it’s no surprise.)
)-: )-:
A good omen?
“Strewth” in the GG: http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,22786179-25090,00.html
“SENATOR Bill Heffernan was having a quiet libation in the Yeoval pub in central NSW when one of his fellow patrons reminded him that famed long-range weather forecaster Inigo Jones not only predicted rural Australia would be in the grip of drought from the mid-1990s to the middle of the first decade of this century but also that the drought would break on November 27, 2007: three days after the election.
Like most farmers, Heffernan would be delighted to see rain but there is a historical hitch that may worry his Liberal Party colleagues. The last long drought correctly predicted by Jones ended when he said it would in 1983, just after Bob Hawke and the ALP swept Malcolm Fraser out of office. Farmers still credit the Silver Bodgie with ending the drought. Jones, who died in 1954, maintained that the whole solar system is simply a vast electromagnetic machine that affects the weather across this planet.”
“An analysis of the clinics confirms the vast majority are in coalition-held seats or very marginal Labor seats.”
Thanks Tony for helping out the ALP with it’s message to the marginals. lol Please someone make him keep talking till 6pm Saturday!!!!
Boring Bob Brown claimed on TV tonight that “there is no real difference between Labor and Liberal”. Surely it’s dishonest for him to deny a preference for the ALP’s policies on IR, Iraq, education and environment.
Middleman 703 – Yes I have to fess up the Green eyed monster stalks by waking and sleeping moments of what?
Who’s on Lateline tonight?
paul k 687
‘Actually good leaders surround themselves with people who are smarter than they are’.
Pity really, Paul K.
Yes, he is only of etc.
Same deal, points One and Two.
710 Observer
Homosexual smear now is it?
Thats not even defamatory any more!
685
Edward StJohn Says:
November 20th, 2007 at 9:58 pm
VB over the water
So for all you “insider” talk you fess up your just another speculator on the make. Why dont you try risk and enterprise and create real wealth and jobs? Why work when you can speculate hey?
“However, it is certainly true that house price inflation has undermined those of us who left here in the late 90s thinking we could make a bundle and then come back quite a few steps up the property ladder…”
Edward, Edward, Edward… I really thought I could expect better than that…
Then again, that is your Modus Operandi, no?
1. Deliberately misrepresent what people say, while displaying your profound ignorance of basic matters, such as economics and finance. So, Edward, as you don’t understand such matters, let me explain: Getting a higher paid job to buy a better house isn’t speculation. It’s called aspiration. It’s not a bad thing. Even John Howard is in favor of this.
2. Coming over all holier-than-thou from a pseudo left perspective to try to wedge your critics. You do this all the time – on the Holocaust, on sexism, etc, etc. Now you’re trying to sound like a Trot. Unfortunately, given your track record, you just come across as what you are: a Hansonite populist blowhard.
Go away, ESJ. Go away, get a job in the real world, and learn a few things.
Andrew Robb. He is demanding a recount in Florida.
Abbott says people are mugs if they don’t vote for the government.
Dear Paul, 716
GST, GST, GST, Meg, GST, Cheryl, GST,
The poor old Dems they never understood that the trouble with straddling the fence is that you end up losing your conjoles.
I reckon the best Election song and I’m not sure of its name but it has the words
“So Johnny your not play cricket this year
Your not playing footy either so what are you doing”
I’m hoping I have not butchered the words
The Howard-Costello transition is getting a lot of airplay. Watching the NFL on Fox (replay of game earlier in the day) and getting the ALP ads!
Obviously, this is resonating in the electorate – I know one thing, my sister (who knows stuff all about politics) hates Costello with a passion! I ask why and its the smirk and she says he wants to screw everyone in the workforce. Ah, the joy!
To write ‘Verbose’ you needed to use the character for ‘dragon’ 4 times in a square. Dragon = ? [but I don’t think Chinese characters work on here) Yes, they can get pretty messy.
Hahahahahahah the guy who turned up 35 minutes late for a nationally televised debate accuses Rudd of not subjecting himself to scrutiny!
Edward St John is your Dog voting for the ALP, gee since its your Dog you clearly have not trained it very well “WOOF”
Diogenes says at #696 “Not surprisingly, the moron was from FNQ”
I object to that typecasting of people from my neck of the woods. Do you normally profile other Australians? Get back in your cave fool.
Luckily I checked. LL is early tonight!
Boring Paul Kavanagh and the DLP. The religious fruit cakes.
G’day Aussieguru01
I thought ESJ was an old dog.
725 BMWofVictoria
It’s Be Good Johnny, Men at Work
It finishes with “you’re a strange kid, Johnny, but I like ya!” Hopefully that’s not the case on Saturday…
Bark worst than his bite
As someone in Adelaide, I get the feeling Labor can win Boothby and Sturt.
VB over the water – LOL
Thanks for the deconstruction.
As for your poor analysis names calling mixed with cliche and poor analysis still amounts to zip.
When is your next self roll play? Cant wait to hear from your “deep throat”, what next Tony Abbott rings you for midnight chats?
I pegged you as a fantasist early on!
701
Just Me Says:
November 20th, 2007 at 10:02 pm
Ya, they store water so we don’t need desalination plants, they retain the potential energy so we can use it to generate electricity instead of burning coal, and the environmental nightmare is?
As I said I really wish the greens would get real.
Very true, and if the policy was perform an economic calculation I would have no problem.
In developed countries where the resources are fully developed and in Australia where pretty much all infrastructure development has stopped. The rest of the world is moving forward with gusto.
Out of curiosity how do you propose we meet our energy needs? As our drought/flood cycles get worse how do you propose we store water?
Be Good Johnny – Men at Work.
Dan, Thanks for that well no all we need is one extra word “NOT”
This election will go down to the wire. We won’t know the result opn election night. Mark my words.
Gee Andrew Robb has charisma, has anyone ever seen him smile.
BMW and ShowsOn
The dogs been loyal so what can I do? The manorhouse is a place of diverse opinions
“Barnacle” Joyce is on LL tonight
For what it is worth speaking with some insider mates Labor seemed to actually believe this is going to be very close, and are not just saying it. Their point is as all polling of the marginals has MOE’s that in many cases can go below the 50% line for Labor 2pp, they can’t claim these seats as “in the bag”. As such they can’t, with any confidence, point to the exact 17 we need (further complicated by the fact WA is looking bad) Which is a completely fair point. Further putting too much credence on the value of any marginal seat bet is a bit foolish given the relatively low real amounts being wagered on individual seats. Of course if Labor ends up getting the 53% of the TPP that it seems it should then the seats will follow, however it still makes them nervous to not be able to say categorically that x seats will fall which adds up to a majority. In saying that… it is not far off at all and the only real worry is WA…
Barnaby Joyce??? That’s the only person they could get?????
I’ve misses a lot of the election night song preferences but to add The Angels’ ‘Am I ever gonna See your face again (No way, get f… etc.)’ to the list if it isn’t there already. I’m almost confident enough to dig it out ready to play (almost).
Barnaby Joyce on LL.
Woo hoo, Barnaby is on Lateline. The village idiot has been let loose.
Sinic, 714
Re Indigo Jones, there is absolutely no records to this effect, its a myth, he never made such precise predictions, those he did make were in many cases years wrong and basically a five year old guessing would have had about the same success rate, the bloke in the pub was just (understandably) taking the drought out of Hefferlump.
Of the topic slightly. But Bowman odds on Sportingbet now have ALP/LP at $1.62/$2.10. Bowman is held by 8.9% by the Libs, and the odds last night had only just come to Labor at $1.80 to $1.90 to the Libs. I honestly didn’t think Bowman would fall, and wasn’t ready to claim the ALP could win there – but the shortening of odds is interesting. Mind you it could just be punters capitalising on the popular thought that Howard is as good as gone.
The Libs are certainly sending out their “big guns” with Joyce on LL – this should be… fascinating
Yep, the brain drain was very evident, most of my smart friends have had to go overseas and I don’t blame them at all – ridiculously unaffordable housing, crap salaries and a govt that doesn’t give two rats about education or them.
What a sad state of affairs.
But you know what Howard thinks, we got them rocks!
It really is sad, we are like some poor communist country that is only capable of flogging off its natural resources. We should have been investing in the future now, preparing now, instead Howard has squandered the last 11 years in office. Now future generations and governments have to put in the hard yards to fix this up. Very sad.
Ding Fart you get Tip… easy in the jungle. 5 seconds ad runnin up our way …lovely pic. Savage.
I admit to a few feelings of concern about the result, but then Andrew Robb confirmed for me today that the Libs are facing a wipeout.
Can someone explain for me what does “investing for the future” as part of Labor policy mean?
(Please showsOn one or two sentences not pictures this time)
Maybe Robb can’t bring himself to smile with all the polling
I hope Barnaby and Bob Katter are on the TV on election night, they make a great night (if Labor wins) an hysterical hoot.
724 : Move on ! The GST and meg Lees were seven years ago.
The issue for this election is how to spend the revenue. No Party (including the Greens as far as I can see) is proposing to abolish the GST. In fact, every Party wants to spent it !
The Democrats think it should be spent on a fairer tax system, brilliant health and education, parental leave, services for the most disadvantaged, international aid and renewable energy; not defence and middle class welfare.
730 zedder- Actually that is not a type-cast. A type-cast would be to say that all people in FNQ are morons. I merely said I was not surprised that the moron was from FNQ. And from my time in FNQ, the fact it voted in Joh and continues to vote LNP by huge margins I feel the comment was more than warranted. And Diogenes lived in a tub, not a cave.
Bowman is certainly gone. Laming is one weird guy – he’s a special case but i won’t be surprised to see other QLD seats around the same margin go as well.
“Based on internet searches”
LMFAO!!!!!!
“690
Lose the election please Says:
November 20th, 2007 at 10:00 pm
VB what is the cost of living like in Britain comparatively?
694
Edward StJohn Says:
November 20th, 2007 at 10:01 pm
681 VB over the water
Your not very bright then considering the cost of living in the UK.”
LTEP.
It’s a tough one. But given house prices and options, both my wife and I feel we’re much better off here. Whenever we go back we’re not too impressed with grocery costs, eating out, etc. I’ve been offered a couple of jobs back in Australia in recent years, but I can’t get the numbers to work.
ESJ.
No I’m not very bright. I’m completely thick. They only employ me because British employers know they can get thick Labor voting Australians for next to nothing. And I’m also venal, with ideas above my station. I bought a house three years ago for 300,000 GBP and sold it – to another thick Australian, no less – for 500,000 GBP. Then I used the profits to buy myself a cheaper – but better house – outright. I know that I did a bad thing. As a Labor voter I should be content with living in a hut, or perhaps a council house. But I keep thinking I should try to better myself. Tell me, will I expunge all my sins if I agree to vote Tory? Or I am damned throughout all eternity? Answers on the back of a postcard, please, to Idontgiveafck, 32, The Mews, Oswestry…
Woof.
Woof.
ESJ. Find your own personal enlightenment… its all in the journey.
http://www.alp.org.au/
Edward StJohn Says: “Can someone explain for me what does “investing for the future” as part of Labor policy mean?”
Yeah, it’s hard when something isn’t framed in “Lib-Talk” – so here goes:
sheep, land, muslims, boats, historically, UNION BOSSES, white, sorry… I mean, UNION BOSSES!
Jim Arneman 2.10 and going down..
Diogenes – Leichardt is a chance to go to the ALP this time.. don’t be too hard on my former home.
Rofl, Kerry O’Brien tightening the screws on Howard on the 7:30 report. Great viewing.
Speaking of fantasists, hows your blog going ESJ?
Lateline flicks from federal politics to a story on whaling.
A portent for the Nantucket Sleigh Ride?
Personal enlightenment middle man?
In politics?
That comes from age, love, family and friends. Irrespective of your politics
Hey. I’m famous!
The people I met this afternoon at their doors are saying I am now nationally
famous and that the Liberals must think they are in big trouble
in Tangney.
And all this because I did not originally show my resignation
letter from my previous job to the Liberal party to get their permission to run
as a Labor candidate.
Those Liberals are very right to think that they can not win this
election on the issues that are affecting the lives of the
voters and their families.
Another stupid Liberal stunt backfires.
Classic TV.
middle man @ 428
“John Howard said on the 7.30 Report… you can’t learn from a book. WTF?!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!”
he meant you can’t teach old dogs (like him) new tricks
On Timor, one thing is worth remembering. DFAT spent all of 99 trying to scotch the expectation in the US that Au would lead an intervention force.
Clinton called Howar and Downer “defeatist” on the question in Feb 99, and said an intervention led by Au would be inevitable.
Howard and Downer were dragged kicking and screaming by the Oz public, who basically put their arm behinf their back, and smashed their face into a wall repeatedly until they started crying and said “ok , ok, someone call the yanks to sort it out”
Clinton heavied Habibie, big time, to let INTERFET go in.
I give Howard 0/10 for that; and the Oz public 10/10 for phase one. Hooray for us.
To be balanced, however, they deserve full marks for how they handled it thereafter. UN resolution in record time, excellent organisational job by the ADF.
Full marks to Howard govt for phase two.
I almost find it to cruel to smack you down Fulvio! I just laugh when you have a lash!
Burgey. hahha!
Well Mark Reynolds didn’t you ge tthe memo that Andrew Robb comes first, the AEC second?
Yes time to move on regarding Democrats but Meg Lees and John gave us that tax and where is Meg now, with her parliamentary salary she is doing okay and able to afford the GST added on bills and other products whilst us poor aussies cop it. Meg Lees and her party decided to trade a few extras for supporting it and just what happened to those policy crumbs the democrats got in return not much in the end.
The Democrats other than Natasha were useless and deserve to become extinct.
Go Mark in Tangney!
Whilst were at it what does “working families” mean?
The Senator told me it was when both the “partners” were Labor MP’s or staffers and the struggles that created
Kerry’s comments on the 7:30 Report about thinking that a government should be judged on their ethical record got largely ignored by JWH. I dare say he was uttering a few choice phrases in his head. Well played Kerry, well played.
Barry, etc @ 667
Yes, no mention. The tape has been wiped. That’s why Kerry’s aside was telling.
Edward StJohn – you are hilarious! Next to Andrew Bolt you are my favourite attempt to be the Australian Steven Colbert!
Good on you Lefty E for some objectivity.
Mark @ 774
‘Onya, Mark!
The only thing that concerns me is that the liberals seem to be out spending labor easily on advertising. What happened to the war chest labor were supposed to have?
VBOTW
You don’t really live in Oswestry do you? I grew up near there and did work experience at the Orthapaedic hospital in Gebowen…
Thanks Grover! I aim to please.
Are you a bit tipsy at the keyboard? I think you meant “While we’re”.
ESJ 783
“Working families”
Seems fairly self explanatory.
What’s your point?
Oh yeah ShowsOn,
The Senator has been letting off steam and opened up some of the “diplomatic red” for the bloggers to unwind whilst we work our fingers off!
Anyone want to tell me the magic first 17 to fall? And back it up with evidence? In light of the marginal polling I am still nervous, particularly when Cowan is looking like going to Libs and I would not hold my breath on getting anything back in the west… (although I feel in my maroon beating heart that Qld is going to swing big.. real big)
Good luck Mark
Tangney to fall with a 13% swing on Saturday due to stupid Liberal stunt backfiring!
Ha! It seems you don’t know who Stephen Colbert is.
asanque, thats the kind of ‘odd’ result I want to see
I thought you’d be down to methylated spirits by now?
Re: 732 :
Insulting someone for being religious (or not religious) is neither clever nor humane. As a Democrat I firmly believe that every person has the right to practice their religion peacefully, and all people have the right to not practice any religion.
Nor is your intolerant comment about me accurate – you clearly have the wrong person !
Well Winston exactly what is a “working family” ?
Is there a definition or is anybody a family? Is a flatmate part of a “working family” for instance?
Anything you want it to mean; it means “you” if your thinking of voting labor, it means “you” if your thinking of voting Liberal.
Thats the key to a modern election campaign, don’t offend more than 50% of the electorate.
Yeah good on you Mark.
Perhaps in recognition of your talents you can run in Nedlands or some other blue ribbon seat next time.
You people are hilarious – the sanctimonious drivel you have spewed forth all because Andrew Robb seeks to see the LAW actually upheld is unbelievable.
What can we expect from the ballot rorters of the ALP anyway? Once again, hypocrisy is thy name.
NB, Figured it out then. We’re a funny mob, aren’t we? Election night song is anything from Pink Floyd’s “Dark Side of the Moon”.
A way to frame an economic debate so your side wins.
… It’s working.
You shouldn’t critique this. How many years have we listened to Howard talk about “giving families a job”.
Dangerous @ 790
No – it’s just my generic forwarding address for dickheads (as also in “Third stump along, Highway 21, East Jesus, Tennessee)”. I think I might have been through there once, so I might be being cruel about the place. I’m more of a Hay-on-wye and Clyro person, meself.
Joyce sounds like his is weaseling out of his comments earlier today.
So is Julia Medicare Gold and the hairdresser a “working family”?
Funny you mention that, I just filled in my 1000th postal ballot.
799 ShowsOn
LOL! Good retort.
774 Mark Reynolds
easy there Mark – this is a hubris free zone……..NOT!
good luck on Saturday
It doesn’t seem that you have quite enough friends over there in WA.
What’s you opinion on the east-west split?
Is the swing over there late in arriving, left already, or never going to happen?
Is it just greed?
Isabella: 56 of the Liberal MP’s have breached electoral laws on failure of accountability and honesty. Prove otherwise.
Yes, I realise my linguistic capacities are nowhere near those of your good self Edward. few indeed are gifted with your ability to spew verbal vitriol with such telling effect.
But I will be celebrating a Labor victory on Saturday night.
You my friend will be sticking pins in a doll with bushy eyebrows.
Barnaby has been spoken to, told to shut his mouth. Barnaby backdown at it again.
it will be funny the libs lose just as robb gets a taste. he’s an unlikeable guy and may get a scare on sat, although he will hang on.
STOP PRESS – Barnaby has thoughts
Mark @ 774, are your knuckles bleeding yet?!
Thanks Old Dog. But it was actually a question. That’s what “?” means.
Who is suprised?
1) Rodent confirms that legistlation will be rushed through to allow Nuclear Power Stations to be built on 7.30 Report tonight
2) Lateline reports that the US Nuclear Power Industry is interested in expanding into Australia.
Coincidence?
marky marky, I was just thinking the same thing. Ron Boswell has clearly taken him aside and given him a spanking.
Asanque 812,
Of course, the Senator has the files right here in the office about the 56 MP’s, the only true enemy is the one in your own party.
ShowsOn….Kerry O’Brien tightening the screws
Classic TV.
Indeeeeeed!
Spent a fair amount of time chatting to the missed it persons, about. They couldn’t bear to watch ‘him’. What a loss. Never mind, it’s on my laptop.
Among chapter headings, classics for the future.
‘Learn by experience’.
Writing down more.
Barnaby is “The Gimp #2″
Oh my god, Barney is giving me a brain ache. WTF is he talking about – I think he’s trying the old “there are known knowns, there are known unknowns, there are….”
Barnaby: yawn
And different thoughts from this morning…weasel out thoughts
for something bipartisan. ACA is on replay on sky. in the middle of an election campaign where its possible the 2nd longest serving PM the country has had could lose office, they are revealing that Alby Mangels may have faked some of the scenes from his 1970’s doco’s.
WTF?????
Barnyard Joys is flipping and flopping all over the place.
Couldabeen, 819.
Whatever happened to Alby Mangels Middle man?
Isabella Says:
November 20th, 2007 at 10:31 pm
You think so, is the Liberal campaign HQ so empty headed that they didn’t expect a reaction from Labor. You bright sparks have just lost a few more thousand votes with this trick.
This is the anti poly election campaign, to pick up votes you go on Rove, not Insiders and you don’t play stupid games; as the 13 prove that it’s just a little Liberal story the whole thing is going to blow up in your face.
George, I agree with you on brain hurt from Barnaby. Remember when he first got there…
I look forward to Bob Ellis’ book on campaign 2007. He could devote an entire chapter to O’Brien V Howard – The Finale.
middleman, dont underestimate the pulling power of alby. he probably shagged more than anyone in the 70’s and 80’s. he’s probably been up half the audience.
my all time fav is ‘incentivation’. little johnny said ‘only a liberal government can give you incentivaion’ and he was right. only a liberal could come up with that.
Barnaby believes Rudd is the Messiah? This is getting to be one very odd election…
Yeah, how did an unemployed bricklayer from Adelaide pull so many models? Nath?
the blond afro?
The bit about allowing Paul Keating back into civil society was funny though…
Maybe Alby could be a Labor “star candidate” next time around?
Oh don’t tell me! Karl Rove is advising Andrew Robb on electoral law, and George W Bush is advising Howard on linguistics.
Barnaby looks like he has been on the Bundy
ESJ. not sure but they found him and put him on ACA to confront him with the damning truth. good for them, hey?
Have a dekko at Barnaby on Lateline. That suit. Looks like he slept in it.
Poor bloke’s on the skids.
LOL – Barnaby putting trust in breakfast TV polls
Barnaby definitely believes there’s “his math” and “the math”…
http://www.albymangels.com.au/
Hahahahahahaha Barnaby J on Lateline trying to say that Newspoll, Galaxy etc are all wrong and that channel 7, 9, 10 phone polls are the true gauge of the populace!!!!! UNBELIEVABLE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Perhaps Alby Mangels took the “children overboard” photos…
And by the way, a “working family” is one that needs new leadership to end the blame game when the education revolution comes.
That’s something you can’t learn from a book.
784 Grover – Its an alien concept for the rodent – he thought Kerrie was talking about a place in England.
Oh dear, the Liberal trolls got let out of the cage! Sadly even Glen has become as bad as Isabella and that Generic person.
Barnaby Joyce providing us with his view on how to mangle english. Must admit i do like him because you cannot keep him on a leash or keep the muzzle attached to his mouth.
Barnaby banana a beautiful icecream.
Just when i thought he had a brain he says John is one of greatest leaders, sorry Barnaby banana you just melted.
Can anyone invite Barnaby onto PB for a looksee? He might get quickly disabused of his pretensions to psephology…
I believe thinking of this sort is a pre-requisite if you want to be a conservative Senator from Queensland.
Barnaby is awful.
If Jho is so god dam good why isn’t his mug on candidates literature, sign etc?
I think you’re right. Maybe nobody has told him there’s an election on Saturday?
William,
Could we have a new blog about the 7.30 report, please? I am just recovering from watching it here in the west. IMO it was the seminal moment to date.
Lateline’s standards are slipping if “Backdoor Barnaby” is the best they can get for an interview LOL
“850
Goodbye Mr T Says:
November 20th, 2007 at 10:42 pm
784 Grover – Its an alien concept for the rodent – he thought Kerrie was talking about a place in England.”
Top marks for that one, GMT. Top marks.
Nath, FYI
From an “Alby” tribute site:
Chick-pulling ability
Judy Green, Tina Dalton, Lucinda-la-Bond-Babe Dunn, and Alby’s favourite, Michelle Els, are just a few of the girls privileged to have known Alby personally. You won’t find a nicer bunch of girls in a documentary anywhere.
I love the reference to privilege to have “known” Alby personally, v.70’s.
7.30 report Howard i/v now up on ABC website.
http://www.abc.net.au/7.30/content/2007/s2096090.htm
Is Rudd the Messiah for someone who hopes to keep on by the seat of his pants?
EJS – wheres your head at tonight, whats this Alby Mangels CRAP ??
when we were teenagers, my brother once did an impression of Alby’s Cleo centrefold at a party… the girls were a bit shocked. Alby used a yachts mast for cover, my brother substituted the post holding up the back deck of the house for the mast.
Labor now ahead in Deakin:
ALP 1.80
COALITION 1.90
Antonio but you can define a working family? Please?
827 middleman. Not Alby???????
Not much point going on if you can’t trust the World Safaris…
Goodbye Mr T Says: “784 Grover – Its an alien concept for the rodent – he thought Kerrie was talking about a place in England.”
LOL MR T! “yes Hyacinth, let’s fly out to Ethics later in the year, sit on the castle lawn and enjoy some lashings of ginger beer and snoseeges.”
Yeah – stupid me. This blog was about it. Archive it. Save it. Will we ever see a prime minister go a beetroot colour like that again for an extended period on national tv? Awesome.
YouTube Poll 20/11/07
ALP avge 3648 hits avge 4.5 days per vid avge rating of 4
Lib avge 2642 hits avge 3.1 days per vid avge rating of 3.1
weighted percentage for ALP (combination of rating vs rating avge, plus hit weighted by days vs hit weighted by days) is 58.4 : 41.6
What always staggered me was how an ugly bloke like Alby got all those girls.
AG01 -
Your obviously not the right age group. I’ll behave now and be serious.
Middleman – that is a classic.
Wonder if he’s got a brown paper bag filled with a bottle of white lightning in his pocket. Maybe he’s taking swigs from it between camera shots.
Has Glen been misbehaving, tonight, Howard Hater?
Antonio. Spot on!
Whats Alby doing thease days & is he still making bogus doco’s?
I know who AB is ESJ?
I don’t think Glen has been in tonight, but earlier in the day, “Bad Glen” was causing havoc.
Now what did I learn from Barnaby? Only one thing, that I’m afraid are the type of people that frequent regional Queensland, an unusual lot, is it true they are thirty years behind.
Old Barnaby the man who gave JHo control of the senate. After Saturday the ALP are going to make him a life member. Posters, mugs, t-towels, pen etc will be available with his picture on them.
Glen is having a rest in the first aid shelter, one to many sherbets.
sorry AM
The sad thing is that there still people dumb enough to vote for the National Party.
red wombat @ 881 -
I think I’ll hold out for the toilet paper.
Mmm.. Might be time to check the odds again. They sure moved earlier on.
Insightful Barnaby quotes tonight:
The only poll that counts, is the the election.
No one will live forever, not me, not you, not anyone.
WOW!
No 603
What’s wrong with Kevin Andrews?
Drunk Glen is very amusing!
Surely he doesn’t get the good stuff? I thought he’d be on mineral turpentine.
ShowsOn
Its public plonk so its free to all Liberals (for the moment)
As I said their a smart lot in regional Queensland.
Kerry Obrien is a joke, his blatant bias was disgusting to watch, he gave the PM no time not even 1 min to talk about his policies and agenda for a 5th term.
His questions sound as if Kevin himself wrote them, you’ll see a ‘love in’ tomorrow with Kevin and Kerry it will be just sickening to watch.
Kerry spent 20mins questioning about IR.
Kerry spent 20mins saying how good Keating was and how bad Howard is at economic management.
Kerry spent 8 mins questioning on nuclear power.
Kerry spent 2mins saying how it will be the last interview as PM.
Did Kerry allow 1 just 1 min for Howard to detail his policies, nup. Far as i am concerned Kerry can be Rudd’s media adviser if he wins the election good riddance!
No 883
You’ve got to be a dill to vote Greens or Labor.
Glen, so you enjoyed the Rodent’s last ever 7.30 Report appearance?
#
516
High Plains Drifter Says:
Ils ne passeront pas! – a latter day Nivelle apparently is our HP Ditser.
I think that for the forces of good Pétain”s On les aura! is more apposite.
How about a dictionary or a book of speeches by Barnaby Joyce now that would be exciting.
887 On the basis of those pearls of wisdom he can always become a rural guru if he loses his senate seat = the chauncey Garner of rural QLd.
Mark Reynolds:
Evidently you haven’t knocked on sufficient doors in the last few days, if your fingers were capable of typing that message. Campaign Central will not be pleased.
Good luck in Tangney, stick it to that nucular-power pushin’, global-warming denyin’ namby-pamby, who can’t even defend his preselection without J-Ho’s intervention.
However I’m not sure the crucial “Mining Company Directors Wives” segment of the electorate is ready to embrace the ALP just yet. Also, I was going for a run near Winthrop Primary on the weekend and did my warmup stretches against a demountable classroom with a plaque saying it had been built thanks to some scheme or other, and opened by Jensen. Grrr, pork knuckles for the kiddies! Maybe you could counter with a “Yacht Purchase Junior Assistance Scheme”?
Generic Person, what’s your attitude towards homosexuality?
ShowsOn, enjoyed your 1st placed comment on Shanahanahanahan’s article today. Amazing change in his journalistic demeanour though, wasn’t it?
No 893
There’s no need to watch Rudd tomorrow. He’ll interview himself and repeat the same cliches he’s been using all year.
Glen, that’s what happens when you run a campaign 99% based on the premise that things were bad under Whitlam, Hawke and Keating.
I think you’ll agree the Liberals were the one’s who brought up the past?
Glen I honestly don’t expect a love-in for Rudd. Kerry O’Brien generally goes hard on all politicians.
Hello friends, and others:
have missed all the fun tonight with Howard vs O’Brien and Barny on LL. Had to count out HTV’s for the booths over a glass of chardy ( of course, and I love a latte in the mornings too).
Can’t help but feel a zing in the air – apart from the ice caps melting. It would seem that the thaw is on and the hearts and minds of voters have moved from their lower regions -ie hip pockets- and are embracing some of the soft left issues – like decency, humanity, a desire for peace, sustainablilty and to hope for more out of life than a wide screen plasma. And so will end the Howard era. Unless I am completely wrong and we are still a pack of total bastards
That sounds like the first draft of the PM’s concession speech!
Wait for the hard hitting comments from Generic Person.
Glen: Just because Howard has a pathetic record on reform, has no future policies, constantly lies and contradicts himself, doesn’t mean Kerry is to be blame.
Howard is the creator of his own downfall, and has so many lies that he constantly contradicts himself.
Kerry merely dissected him and exposed Howard for the fraud with no ide he really is.
Lets give Howard 1 minute to talk about his future policies?
What policies?
Union scare tactics?
Lets talk about the past, unless its Howard’s past.
John Howard. Time to go.
Geez Glen, if you’ve gotta hurl, please do it the toilet bowl, not here.
Oh, that’s okay, Howard Hater.
He can bet a bit, you know.
Good that he’s resting.
Glen,
It was beautiful to watch!
Julie 362
ViggoP 395
Helen 664
Hallelujah, The Tao of Kevin Rudd –
The basis of that music video was an article by Annabel Crabb in SMH, a very interesting, and a surprising article, about Kevin Rudd few days ago. See Mixed blessings for Rudd.
http://www.smh.com.au/news/opinion/mixed-blessings-for-rudd/2007/11/16/1194766964931.html
William re 858,seconded. History & all that…and Kezza’s poignant painful and polished sign off.
Glen I honestly don’t expect a love-in for Rudd. Kerry O’Brien generally goes hard on all politicians.
That though will be the excuse if Rudd does well.
It wasn’t bias, he forced him to answer difficult questions. The questions were so well researched and presented that it made Howard’s hypocrisy obvious.
It was a tremendous political interview from one of the best political reporters our country has produced.
No. Those questions were designed to get Howard to add some shades of grey to his propaganda. Kerry wanted Howard to give some credit to some people other than himself. If Howard was able to show some humility there O’Brien would’ve given him a free run to spout some policy. But Howard couldn’t admit that Labor did some things in office that were good, including some things he hadn’t thought of.
Howard’s proposition that Labor didn’t introduce enterprise bargaining is a howler that even a first year politics student wouldn’t make in an exam.
FFS! Political interviews shouldn’t simply be about reporters bowling under arm and getting hit for 6. O’Brien wanted to get some information out of Howard that Howard didn’t want to give. Enough said.
No 900
I have no objection to homosexuals, although I believe
a) marriage is between a man and a woman
b) homosexuals should not be entitled to adopt children. It is contrary to natural biology.
Otherwise, they should have similar rights to heterosexuals in all other respects.
Check out this tribute “Alby” website and the photo of the 2 geeks who set it up at the bottom:
http://members.optusnet.com.au/alcalder2/alby.htm
Modest Alby quote about the womanising:
“People think that I’m a real womaniser. Well, I mean, I don’t say I’m not, but I’m not as bad as they think I am. I mean… in World Safari Two I had about six or seven women – call it ten women, right? And those ten women came on the screen in an hour and a half or two hours, right? But that was over a period of eight years!”
If you are wondering if the LNP are worried about their base support:
http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2007/11/20/2096370.htm?section=justin
Farmers?? My God if they’re worried about them switching then the rout is well and truly on.
No, Kerry, I was just being ironic.
Wrong!
Glen is out again!
After all that cordial.
Anyway, just put him into time out. He’s not simply himself.
Less than 100 hours to the big day and I think it’s time to make a prediction.
At 54/46 right now and the nation direly in need of a Howard-ectomy the danger is what a 2% swing could do this week. 2% to the Government this week could see them cling to power in a close result – Oh the agony.
However, if there is a swing of 2% this week, it aint going to go to JWH. Rudd hasn’t made a mistake so far this week and the liberal campaign reels from pathetic to desperate to backward looking and negative then straight back to desperate.
I’m predicting a 55/45 2pp split. This Government deserves a further swing against it this week and a decisive loss.
That’s 92-56-2
Try these 2pp swings to the ALP on Antony’s ABC site for the same seat result.
NSW 7.7
VIC 6.5
QLD 8.9
WA 1.0
SA 6.1
TAS 2.9
NT 2.9
Interesting Labor gains include Bennelong (a fitting end for a horrible man), Wentworth, Deakin, McMillan, Hinkler, Leichardt, Boothby (I’d prefer Sturt), Corangamite (don’t they hold by-elections when the sitting member passes on anymore?), Page, Dickson and Robertson.
I’m predicting a loss of the senate majority for the coalition, with at least one state giving a 3 ALP 2 Lib 1 GRN result (most likely TAS, VIC or NSW). I am not hopeful of the Libs losing their ACT Senate spot (although it would be wonderful).
Hopefully we will see 6 or 7 Greens in the Senate, plus Xenephon and Fielding. Ideal result would be for the ALP to have a majority with the Greens, but most likely they’ll need all non-coalition senators support to pass their legislation.
My election night playlist will follow shortly.
GP 915
Who would you turn GAY for?
No 907
There’s nothing out of the ordinary in the Howard-O’Brien interview. It was an average performance from both, but certainly not shockingly awful.
Generic Person, I assume you wont answer my question as to your attitude on homosexuality.
No 924
I believe you’re not paying attention. I outlined my beliefs on homosexuality at post 916.
Let’s be honest… Kerry went pretty easy on Howard, who when you consider what he has done deserves FAR greater scrutiny.
And I’d hope Kerry is just as tough on Rudd tomorrow night! That’s what we expect Mr O’Brien to do!
No 922
Not you.
Asanque he has future policies Obrien is a Labor hack that he wont even let Howard say one positive thing about his election platform not give him one question on his education or housing policies not 1 question about the future from Kerry.
OK we’ll see if its non bias from the shmuck Kerry, ok so in order for Obrien not to look biased he’ll have to:
Spend 10mins on how inexperienced Rudd is.
Spend 10mins on how inexperienced his front bench is.
Spend 10mins on all his gaffes throughout the election campaign and the Unions links to Labor.
If Kerry does none of these he’ll have shown complete bias.
ah, got it. just trying to sense the boundaries of your insanity.
I’m bored with the election can we start the recriminations now?
Asanque – couldnt have put it better myself. The future is another country for rodent and he basically doesnt have the relevant passport
LEIGH SAYLES!
(What did she do with her gold shirt?)
By Generic person’s argument about gay adoption, I assume he thinks that it is “un-natural” for a single parent to raise a child because it is contrary to natural biology ?
“848
Dario Says:
November 20th, 2007 at 10:41 pm
Hahahahahahaha Barnaby J on Lateline trying to say that Newspoll, Galaxy etc are all wrong and that channel 7, 9, 10 phone polls are the true gauge of the populace!!!!! UNBELIEVABLE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!”
After Saturday Howard and co will be elected to the Morning Show.
Terrible interview with Joyce tonight. He looked terrible (tiredness, make-up problems, ???) and was fairly inarticulate. Theories on psephology were going vaguely ok until he started talking about breakfast TV. Basic point was that he doesn’t believe the polls, he would have been better to just stick to that point, expressed in those terms, rather than blather on about statistical models and so on.
As for Leigh, she contributed to it being the waste of time that it was. Why ask him five times (or was it six) why are the polls so bad? And each time he replied (in effect) “I don’t believe them”. She could have asked twice, that was all that was needed really. I guess she couldn’t think of any other questions.
KERRY O’BRIEN: In your final comments in the debate with Mr Rudd, you included in your future vision for Australia, this was your final statement, three goals of your education revolution. Each one involved going back to the past, back to basics.
JOHN HOWARD: I’m not advocating an education revolution.
KERRY O’BRIEN: You used the term, you used the term education revolution.
JOHN HOWARD: I use it in a rather ironic way.
KERRY O’BRIEN: I thought it slipped out and then you had to kind of correct it a bit.
JOHN HOWARD: I was being ironic.
Comedy gold.
Nath, Generic Person,
Do you think Alby would have indulged in a little man s.x on World Safari 2 ? if he was feeling a little lonely?
Only news from portlandbet is Higgins into $6.00 from $7.75 last check. I neglected to mention earlier that Forde was in to $2.50. Someone must have bet a fair bit against Costello. Surely Higgins couldn’t really be at risk? Forde – maybe.
Sorry GP 928, Howard is already taken by Cossie.
Awe, glen has awoken and is having a wittle tandy about poor uncle howie having a twuf time on Kewy’s show. Boo hoo.
“Spend 10mins on all his gaffes throughout the election campaign ”
??? Garrett had a couple… but Rudd?
ESJ, alby’s a red blooded australian man, if there were no women to be had on the journey he would reluctantly start looking for a sheep.
Glen at 929:
What policies do the Libs have for the future?
I haven’t seen a single ad on them.
Can you name a few that are not blatant bribes and will actually assist productivity, education and infrastructure?
Other things contrary to natural biology:
Women who are sterile
Men who are infertile, due to low sperm counts
I think marriage should be privatised. I have no idea why consenting adults need a government certificate to say they are married. That’s a little too 18th century for my liking.
A “counterintuitive” experience today whilst doorknocking in Eden Monaro. I spoke to several (maybe 30 or so) housing commission type families this morning. They were all quite aware of the election, had a pretty good grasp of the issues, knew the candidates, and mostly knew where the polling booths were. Unsurprisingly, they were all very polite, and couldn’t wait to vote against Howard. Later in the day I was in a much more upmarket area. Several people were unaware of the most basic details of the coming election. One apparently middle class family at a nice house really surprised me. They were adamant that the election was last weekend. The wife was certain that she had seen the result in the sunday paper!
916 Generic Person Says: November 20th, 2007 at 10:56 pm
What about IVF? That’s ‘contrary to natural biology’ isn’t it? I mean if ‘god’ didn’t want them to have a kid, shouldn’t that make it wrong?
Sorry , perhaps I’ve missed something but whyTF are you all talking about Alby???
Generic Person @ 916
Homosexuals adopting young is contrary to natural biology?
http://ronnmills.blogspot.com/2006/11/gay-adoption-in-animal-world.html
No 934
No, it’s the unnatural idea of a child having two fathers or two mothers, not the virtues of single parenting.
915 Generic Person your comments are so backward.
Who cares what sex rears children as long as the child can reach his full potential and is looked after with the compassion and love that every household can provide.
All gender couples can have problems and whatever sexual partners wish to parent a child i have no problems.
Orphuch, I reckon you and Enemy Combatant could do a running commentary over the next three days, with intermittent bits from Possum, some of the rest of us could chime in but only if funny (adjudicator required..?). William, do you think psephology could be humorous?
Old JHo must of upped the meds……..made no sense and no twitching shoulder.
Generic Person Says: “No, it’s the unnatural idea of a child having two fathers or two mothers, not the virtues of single parenting.”
Um, that has nothing to do with Biology and everything to do with your homophobia.
Glen woke up and now he can walk!
Here’s the video footage: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VD7_7SXsHU8
Can the ABC employ Gretel Killeen to announce the Winner on Election night ?
GP will never change his/her mind so there’s little point debating it.
Generic Person 916 totally agree with your position on homosexuality.
Why HH??? Kerry Obrien was after all press secretary to Prime Minister Gough Whitlam and yet he is supposed to be Mr Independent for god’s sake! Kerry votes Labor you know it, I know it but he carries on with this facade about being balanced what a load of bull butter.
No 947
Yes, it is contrary to natural biology and hence I would also reject IVF.
I prefer this:
And I quote:
‘In bonobos for instance, strict heterosexual individuals would not be able to make friends in the flock and thus never be able to breed,” Bockman told LiveScience. “In some bird species that bond for life, homosexual pairs raise young. If they are females, a male may fertilize their eggs. If they are males, a solitary female may mate with them and deposit her eggs in their nest.”
‘Almost a quarter of black swan families are parented by homosexual couples. Male couples sometimes mate with a female just to have a baby. Once she lays the egg, they chase her away, hatch the egg, and raise a family on their own.’
My God, that’s so … unnatural!
Dont worry about those messy family issues GP, Garrett said all children will be socialised and publicly owned by the government once Labor is elected on Saturday
Glen, I suppose you call Allan Jones objective and unbiased!
GP-
have you seen some of the offspring a hetero couple can produce?
Look at howard’s front bench for example
@948
Jen – Hard hitting expose on Alby and his wicked, wicked ways back in the 70’s and 80’s on ACA tonight.
Some here think it is a bit strange that the worlds leading current affairs show wasn’t concentrating on the Federal Election.
GP @ 959
“Yes, it is contrary to natural biology and hence I would also reject IVF.”
Are you married? Male? Female? Age range?
Your bizarre view needs some context for me to take it in.
I actually don’t mind people like Generic Person having such views on adoption or even abortion, but its the denying of those rights to others that I object to.
No 954
I’m not at all homophobic. It is a biological fact that homosexuals cannot conceive children.
Belated (I was out and missed it all) thanks to George for his reporting of Kerry v Rodent
Glen at 929 wrote:
What policies do the Libs have for the future?
I haven’t seen a single ad on them.
——————————————-
No, no, I won’t stand for that!
There’s the Orangutan Initiative!
“959
Generic Person Says:
November 20th, 2007 at 11:06 pm
No 947
Yes, it is contrary to natural biology and hence I would also reject IVF.”
And organ transplants?
No 966
It is not bizarre to believe in natural conception.
I’m gay and I’m pretty sure if I slept with a woman I could conceive a child.
GP @ 959
“Yes, it is contrary to natural biology and hence I would also reject IVF.”
Reject in an ideological sense?
Or reject as in “my body is rejecting my new baboon heart”?
Jen- spot on, and it produced Generic person as well.
No 971
I have no objection to organ transplants.
893 Glen
Wait a minute Glen. I thought the media had been biased in the way it hadn’t cross-examined Rudd’s policies and agenda. Now, when Howard doesn’t talk about it, it’s because the media is biased and isn’t giving him a chance? Which one is it? You can’t have your cake and eat the candles too.
Hey Glen, glad to see you’re back. I noticed on an earlier thread you were sinking the boots into the Scientologists again. What have they ever done to you?
Generic Person Says: “I’m not at all homophobic. It is a biological fact that homosexuals cannot conceive children.”
You really are an ignaramous. What has biology got to do with a lifestyle choice? Females have children. Males don’t. Your logic is then that gay women should be able to marry and have children but not men. Boy, what a bafoon!
That “marriage is only for a man and a woman” deal has always made me laugh.
50% divorce rate and its a “sacred” instution, “specially” for them.
Talk about rewarding failure!
Genital Person – I will vote for your offsping marrying each other. That way we clean up the gene pool.
Don’t tell me, last three days and we have to put up with a homosexuality wedge.
GP @ 972.
Can you put your view in some context for me? Age? Marital status? Sex?
Lesbians can GP, its called turkey basting I believe!
Are you sure you know what the word “homosexual” means?
And let me guess, only via the missionary position?
970
does that mean they have ditched saving the whales?
Or will they all get a tax cut.
He disapproves of that because that’s not “natural biology”.
It is missionary position or nothing, and he’s getting nothing.
And Barrie Cassidy was Hawkie’s Press Secretary, yet chucked a Tanty because Kevin preferred to spend quality time with Rove rather than the Insiders.
Hey hey everyone, settle down. Just remember we are all Christians here, right.
I don’t think anyone seriously doubts KO’B’s political persuasion. And obviously he and Howard don’t get on – that was laid bare in the wrangle over the ‘96 debate, and what has happened since to change it? Although I suspect there was a time when KO’B saw interviewing Howard as a challenge, Howard used to be very good at “stand and deliver” type stuff where you just say whatever you want and the interviewer has to live with it. Howard’s skills in that area have waned in the last 5 years, I reckon.
But I wouldn’t be surprised if KO’B went in hard on Rudd tomorrow. The key theme would be inexperience – why should anyone believe you’re up to the job? Could be interesting, if it happens.
GP and Glen-You are going to lose the “natural” argument. Using that argument, we should let people die of cancer because it is unnatural to intervene. I’d move on to surer ground if I were you.
Im not homophobic but I do have a question? Can I ask it?
No 973
Your sexual affairs are your business.
My view is that children should not be raised in homosexual relationships.
GG @ 90
“Hey hey everyone, settle down. Just remember we are all Christians here, right.”
Die, infidel.
What?
Watching Lateline.
Barnaby Choice?
Depends on the hour, I guess.
# 968 Generic Person Says: November 20th, 2007 at 11:09 pm
Que? I didn’t realise homosexuals were sterile. How does that work?
go for it ESJ
Hi Again
(Just been answering emails)
Obviously I have better things to do than answer trolls, Isabella,
but thanks for your encouragement. I am quite happy in Tangney
and only seek a better federal government and a better local
member to be content. (And maybe I would like to meet
your sister Tabitha one day).
Thanks too for everyone else’s best wishes etc. One of my knuckles
is indeed bleeding.
There are many interesting things to say about the campaign
over here in the west. But I can’t. Sorry.
Keep up the good work pollbludgers: but do get out when you can
and convince some swinging voters.
Generic Person Says: “My view is that children should not be raised in homosexual relationships.”
Then your “view” has nothing to do with biology but with homophobia.
MM @ 995,
That’s not very white of you.
I love (in the platonic sense) most gay men – usually very witty and lots of flair and elan, but why are so many lesbians so deadly serious and self righteous all the time?
No 992
No Diogenes, you don’t have to take an all-or-nothing approach. When it comes to the issue of bringing children into the world, only a man and a woman can naturally arrive at that outcome.
Circumventing that process through IVF, adoption or what not is inappropriate.
im not sure about that ESJ, in my experience most women are bi.
So why is it the government’s business when consenting adults want to marry each other?
You’re such a nanny stater, trying to run other people’s lives.
The Finnigans 912.
Nice work by Annabel and it begat a great opus. Now if only she could do a similar story on JWH which would beget?
Be nice to Generic Pierson, you’d be edgy if you had to talk to yourself all day because you couldn’t get a decent debate going on your own site.
Talking about lesbianism:
http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,22794534-12377,00.html
Totally irrelevant (as is much of this discussion), but it’s something…
Have I chanced upon a blog about sexual orientation?
1002 @ – you mean in the same way the white heterosexual middle class managerial men are serious and self righteous all the time?
Does that mean all single parents should have their children taken from them?
You don’t seem to realise that most people who use IVF are heterosexuals.
I hope you’ve got your candidacy sorted out Mark
You might not be on Andrew Robb’s Christmas Card list.
1003 Generic Person Says: November 20th, 2007 at 11:15 pm
What does that have to do with raising a child?
Why are we discussing homosexuality on a psephological board?
Getting back on topic:
Movement for Labor in QLD:
Flynn
NATS 1.55
ALP 2.32
Herbert
ALP 1.53
LIBS 2.35
Longman
LIBS 1.54
ALP 2.35
Petrie
LIBS 1.80
ALP 1.95
Ryan
LIBS 1.44
ALP 2.62
1003 GP-why is conception ie creating life, different from saving lives?
Glen 958 says
“Generic Person 916 totally agree with your position on homosexuality”
Let’s keep the smut out of this blog, and don’t try to introduce it by the back door.
No 1005
I would temper my marriage views by saying that civil unions would be fine in the alternative.
GP @ 1003
“No Diogenes, you don’t have to take an all-or-nothing approach. When it comes to the issue of bringing children into the world, only a man and a woman can naturally arrive at that outcome.
Circumventing that process through IVF, adoption or what not is inappropriate.”
Adoption is now circumventing natural processes to bring children into the world?
What happens if they don’t get adopted, GP? Do they just remain in stasis indefinitely?
just put it under the broad theme of politics HH.
887
John Hunt Is A Coward Says:
November 20th, 2007 at 10:48 pm
Insightful Barnaby quotes tonight:
The only poll that counts, is the the election.
No one will live forever, not me, not you, not anyone.
WOW!
sounds as though Barnaby J had a bit of a “Carl Rackerman cricket commentry esque” thing going on tonight – (might rain…….. might not)
ESJ while you indulge us in your Alby Mangels fetish can you tell us what that got to do with election 07? And some how I get the vibe that your a single lonely man…am I right?
By-line on Sky news… “Newhouse in strife”.
“The Liberal Party has foreshadowed a possible legal challenge if Labor’s Goerge Newhouse wins the marginal Sydney seat of Wentworth, after Liberal frontbencher Andrew Robb received legal advice that Mr Newhouse’s candidacy is invalid.”
Yeah. Strife. Sky news editors at their very best.
Howard Hater, how much have these seats moved since a day ago?
Why are we talking about homosexuality? Is this still about the TT interview yesterday? Or has Kevin come out, or something?
I’m sure there are plenty of other sites devoted to discussions about sexual morality, and the politics of reproduction.
Is GP an auto-cephalo-proctologist (a man who is paid to stick his head up his own arse)? Anybody that rants about sexuality as if it is axiomatic with biology is presumably avoiding the elephant in the corner, i.e. their own gender orientation. Biology, apart from the tool kit, has nothing to do with it, you are a most likely a repressed homosexual if you are ventilating these thoughts in public. Hit the room of mirrors, admit the Tories are stuffed and find a like-gendered partner. Then you’ll find ‘serenity now’.
# 1019 Generic Person Says: November 20th, 2007 at 11:17 pm
I didn’t realise we all had to ask for your permission for anything.
William, we need a new thread…
El Nino Says:
November 20th, 2007 at 11:16 pm
1002 @ – you mean in the same way the white heterosexual middle class managerial men are serious and self righteous all the time?
No El Nino, I’d say lesbians are entitled to their own category of serious and self righteous.
“1002
Edward StJohn Says:
November 20th, 2007 at 11:14 pm
I love (in the platonic sense) most gay men – usually very witty and lots of flair and elan, but why are so many lesbians so deadly serious and self righteous all the time?”
What next Eddie? “Some of my best friends are Jews”?
That’s what ALL marriages should be. Government’s have no write charging money just so consenting adults can marry.
It should be a private contract between consenting adults, the government should have nothing to do with it.
Geez GP, it’s obvious that as with Dame Edna, homosexuality leaves a nasty taste in your mouth.
Guys the thing about marriage is its a church tradition that is being given the force of law, and we are supposed to be a secular society.
So either:
a) The government disavows marriage and so any social group or church or gay pub can marry someone..
or..
b) The government makes marriage secular and non discriminatory.
There is no other option beyond these two that is rational and ethical.
No 1008
Excuse me, Pi, but it was nath who asked me for my view. If you don’t like it, I’m not going to try to change your mind.
And for the record, I am not religious at all. I believe the bible is a load of rubbish.
#947 – i sorta understand – i’ve thought for a while that until very recently, infertility was natures way of terminating your breeding success line. i do, however, feel dreadfully sorry for those whose genetics do not support their desires/embedded proclivities
ah, aussieguru01 continues his fetish in trying to ascertain the identity of ESJ.
1006 CT
well the good news is you can vote for Fundies First who (in)famously declared that lesbians should be burnt at the stake. And good thing too by all accounts from some of our most informed bloggers.
This discussion is both hilarious, and a frightful waste of Williams bandwidth.
You can’t talk people out of their prejudices – let’s just leave these insecure tossers to themselves.
What about WA – why ISN’T the swing on to the same extent?
It’s probably the lesbians you hang around.
Use smaller implement.
Ahem, enough silliness about that. Barnaby on Lateline was a bit much. I do like the surreal turn this campaign has taken – it makes it just a tad more interesting than it should be.l
To be fair to Generic Person, his views on this board are consistent with a very conservative person, more than likely from the english home counties.
I liked the Barney comment: ‘I’d like to live forever, but I won’t. You wont live forever, your viewers wont live forever’.
The man is a genius. I think it is tactically quite a defensive move to be having Barney on at this stage of the game. Are they particularly worried about Qld? He seemed to be mentioning Qld State govt a lot.
Man this thread has become more gay than last night’s today tonight interview.
Can we get back on topic plz!
DGW 921.
Don’t worry about ACT senate. Humphries is on his way out.
Last poll (can’t remember what it was) had ALP / LIB / Greens 48/25/20 which gives Kerrie the number two spot easily. Humphries needs at least 30 primary because the rest of the ticket is against him.
GetUp has done wonderfully for us here in the ACT.
This is insane (not just this thread) – Centrebet has more volatility in its betting odds than Betfair. In fact, whilst Betfair currently has Labor at $1.26, there is over $70000 worth of unmatched bets on Labor at $1.27. Meanwhile, there’s only about $300 on the Coalition at $4.70.
onimod its hard to tell what is and isn’t a waste of william’s bandwith because he hasn’t actually said what he wants his blogs to be about (well beyond australian politics) and thats a lot of things.
Glen,
Get over yourself please.. Kerry may have slight bias to Labor… I will give you that… but he is one of a very few on our side… I bet the bloggers here could name 100 journos that have anywhere between slight to blatant bias towards the coalition. eg every f**ker on Sky, almost every f**ker at GG… and the undisputed champions of the ‘I Love Liberals Club’ – Those knobs at The West.
Dyno – the politics of sex is the key to the sex of politics. Make of that what you will.
ESJ @ 1030 – having worked for both, I don’t understand the difference in the categories. Please enlighten me.