The latest Newspoll shows an increase in Labor’s federal two-party lead to 61-39 from 59-41 a fortnight ago. Kevin Rudd’s lead over Brendan Nelson as preferred prime minister has narrowed marginally from 73-9 to 71-10. No word yet on the Liberal leadership preference questions which Newspoll was apparently asking respondents over the weekend (see the update on the previous Morgan post).
UPDATE: Graphic now available. The favoured Liberal leader is Malcolm Turnbull (25 per cent) ahead of Peter Costello (23 per cent), Brendan Nelson (15 per cent), Julie Bishop (13 per cent) and Tony Abbott (6 per cent). Support for the three proposed leadership teams (Nelson/Bishop, Turnbull/Robb, Costello/Turnbull) divided about evenly, while Turnbull leads Wayne Swan as “preferred Treasurer” 35 per cent to 29 per cent. In spite of everything, Brendan Nelson’s satisfaction rating is a presentable 38 per cent.
484 Comments
Uh-oh, Newpoll has been Morganified …
355 B.S. Fairman Thanks I could remember what it was called so I simplified. From the previous now closed thread.
Newspoll. Say no more. Say no more.
Brendan Nelson will not be leader for much longer.
With the 2PP at 61-39 to the ALP and the preferred PM ratings at 71 -10 for PM Rudd, who in the opposition will be the first to jump ship for someone else other than Nelson?
B.S.Fairman, From previous thread, Eddixender just doesn’t like the like the sorts who might question why he’s got a clue about anything, really.
I did like the description of Brendon Nelson on Insiders that he was the “rebound boyfriend” for the liberal party and they will dump him and find someone they are happy with for the long term.
The only dark cloud for the the ALP is that have let loose to many genies in the 2020 conference and will be exposed as elite lefties in the year to come. Well, I guess, we’ll see – personally I like the idea of ideas.
If I was Brendon I wouldn’t be counting on Kevin 24/7 tripping up too soon.
Here’s the latest from the votemaster. The combined total of money raised by both the Democrats blows the Repugs away. This is sort of money is why George Bush won the last election. Only its 100 times more.
http://www.electoral-vote.com
sondeo@4: apparently it’s Tony Abbott.
Chris B. It is turning into the Cheese Shop. I want Turnball played by Cleese. Who get’s to be the Norwegian Blue?
Please PLEASE make Tony Abbott the next leader of the Libs
Sinowestie, I laughed and laughed. They just might!
sigh! “people skills” Abbott would be the perfect next sacrifice to be sent to slaughter, let Sir Bullalot sweat a bit longer lol.
The next leader of the Liberals will be David Flint: they’ll give him Bronwyn Bishop’s seat on Sydney’s Northern Beaches LOL
You think I’m joking? Anything is possible with this lot.
Wonder if the Rudd will ramp up the republican debate just to cause confusion with the progression of Nelson succession plots.
So Nelson has “clawed — back” from 9 to 10%. Strange words for a 1 % increase even if in regular use. Must be really rusted on right wingers.
If Turnball became Leader it may help the ALP in the long run. He will stumble once the pressure really goes on and then who will be Leader? Libs will be in even more despair and will carp even louder and more often. All pretense will be gone and they will be without hope.
They are sooo last century!
And the Poisoned Dwarf is channelling the naysayers re post 2020.
http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,23570529-33435,00.html
I was slightly optimistic in my earlier prediction on the previous thread.
But still within the MOE on the 2PP and didn’t predict nelson gaining 1 point (although still within the MOE).
It just may be that most of the punters polled had been affected a little by all the negative spin surrounding the 2020 summit and of course this would have occurred prior to the interim report becoming public.
The veritable flood of negativity emanating from the News Ltd outlets and ABC since Sunday afternoon would most probably in response to the poll results, hoping to capitalise on a bounce ^ for Nelson and better figures on the 2PP than Morgan.
On the whole though, it’s not looking too promising for Nelson’s leadership credentials or the Liberal Party as a viable alternative at present.
Kina @ 14
I’m sure you’re right, the republican issue will cause havoc among the Liberals. They are so far behind on the issues it is almost painful to watch.
FC @ 16…..lucky thing is virtually no-one bothers to read Milne. As my kids say: snorology!
I always bypass any piece I see written by the Fecal Midget, it is usually spiteful rubbish.
How long is this ‘honeymoon’ going to last? And what in God’s name will make make the LNP into a real talented Opposition? What happens if Turnbull, Costello and others fail to make any indentation? Will they split to reform if nothing changes?
I eagerly await Shaninigans “comeback kid” article piece!
Kina, the Libs are down and Rudd has got his boot firmly planted on the neck of the carcass.
He, although coming across as a likeable person with firm and noble aspirations for the future of this country, is also a ruthless political operator.
I can’t see him letting up on them and be willing to give them any oxygen between now and the next election. Rudd learned a lot from observing Howard in operation and you can be sure that he will take every opportunity to wedge the Libs that he can, and keep them continually on the back foot struggling for relevance
It may pay to get used to seeing polling figures similar to these for a long time yet. Glen & Co are in for a miserable 30 months till the next election. There will be no little rays of sunshine creeping over the horizon for a considerable period.
Kina, I think it is way too early to expect the Libs to show up on the respectability radar. They really blew it when in office. They got their policies wrong as well as their leadership. They effectively abandoned their duties a long time before the lost office. That is clear to everyone now.
The country has been wanting change for a long time and now it’s being delivered. As long as this continues, I think the government will remain ascendant. Why should ths change?
On tonight’s news, how out of date did Dolly look? Stuttering and stammering in a dark dingy room that looked like it was last decorated in the 50s with a picture of the queen in her prime hanging above him telling his audience of ancient monarchists (Dolly was the youngest one there) that he would fight to keep the monarchy safe from that evil Mr Rudd.
To think one time hearing these clowns spruke this sort of crap would have made me angry now I just burst out laughing.
How must Allbull be feeling LOL
Dreadful polling figures for the coalition. Disgraceful actually. Nelson will be politically euthanised a couple of weeks after the budget, meaning a 6 month stint as opposition leader.
The template is set. Turnbull will be given 6 months. If he is a dud who then? Bishop? Abbott? Hockey? No, no and no. Lightweights the lot of them. They’d be eaten alive by a rampant government addicted to the taste of blood like Dracula in a Red Cross boutique.
Costello still hasn’t resigned. Sitting there, waiting, silent, brooding. He’d relish the prospect of the party who spurned him possibly begging him to stand as leader. Trouble is he would also be mauled and would almost certainly lose the next election.
I still reckon he’d accept it though. As Skyhooks once sung, ego is a dirty word.
Nelson, Abbot, Downer, Costello, Pyne Turnbull, Minchin…the Liberals now have enough castrati on their benches to rival the Vienna Boys choir in shrillness.
Maybe Shannahan is taking a break from being the “front man” for bad polling results.
Samantha Maiden is heading the online Political News.
http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,23578004-601,00.html
Has anyone been checking the Bookies odds lately at all?
It would be interesting to see what the latest prices are on the Lib Leadership question and the Coalitions chances at the next election.
I would think that Labor would have to be at almost unbackable odds now and the LNP must be blowing right out.
One thing you have to concede with the Coalition, is that their “core constituency” which has hovered around the 40% mark for decades, is holding on fairly well. If that starts to drop though, they will be in really big trouble.
http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,23578004-601,00.html
Scorpio we’ve been getting used to these polling figures since January last year i think i can manage until 2010.
Although i prefer Nelson over Turnbull the perception is that Nelson is a dud and the media won’t recast his label anytime soon.
So bearing this in mind, perhaps the Liberals are having their Crean before their Beazley.
I wouldn’t say the Liberals are bereft of talent i mean if you go past Rudd you have an unpopular Gillard and who else nobody really so to say that the Liberals would be done without Nelson or Turnbull is a silly proposition.
Realistically though both sides are bereft of ‘ready made’ leadership talent when casting aside the two top challengers of both sides.
Scorpio
You are right about the 39% but consider that against Rudd’s 71% rating as preferred PM. That means that roughly 10% of the electorate, or one coalition voter in four, wants a coalition government but prefers Rudd to Nelson as PM!
The by elections will be quite funny if these figures keep up. I can just imagine how any decision to have another contest in McEwen will be greeted in the Liberal bunker. One less rathole to hide in.
Glen, sorry mate, but I have to disagree with you on both the “talent” issue within the Labor Party and the Leadership statement.
There are a number of potential replacements for Rudd if he got hit by a bus tomorrow and they have a fairly good public persona.
Unfortunately on your side, the highest polling candidate is Costello and he has already passed up the poisoned chalice.
I doubt very much that it would be a very attractive prize for him at the moment with polling figures like these.
And just think, back in November 2006 John Howard was supremely arrogant, fully confident of winning another election and imaging the implementation his personal agendas and, planning a further weakening of the ALP. He thought he controlled everybody and everything and none dared oppose him for fear of retribution.
We then witnessed someone walk up to this national bully and give him a fair slap across the face. From that moment on it never got better for the stunned Howard. Rudd tormented him in a thousand ways, Downer’s extreme jealousy and spite leaked out at every interview and, with the Howard faced being publicly trashed, the others had nowhere to hide, their incompetence on show.
They walked the Green Mile struggling all the way.
And now Rudd torments their souls in Hell as well. There is certain justice in this if we recall the Howard years.
30
Glen
an unpopular Gillard
Got some evidence of that?
“There are a number of potential replacements for Rudd if he got hit by a bus tomorrow and they have a fairly good public persona.”
Such as???
Gillard is unpopular but is Deputy PM, nevertheless who else is there?
It’s one thing to criticise us for a lack of ‘ready to go’ leadership talent but when the ALP is in the same position as us talent wise then it is a spurious thing to use it to attack the Liberal Party.
Kina the Howard years are some of the best years this country has had and yet you describe them as hell! I suppose you will thank Mr John Howard for saving the Australian economy so Rudd can spend it all on his christian socialist agenda!
34
Just Me – ask any jo blow they don’t like Gillard, even Labor supporters don’t like her or want her as leader!
Socrates Says: @ 31,
This would have to be more than a major concern within the Liberal bunker. Talk about wailing and the gnashing of teeth.
This reminds me a bit of the period just prior to the election campaign when Howard’s PPM figure was higher than the Liberal Primary vote figure. The trouble then though, was the stupid gitts thought that this meant that they should stick with Howard at the helm and look where that got them.
This time, there is no light at the end of the tunnel. Not even a faint glow. I really don’t know what must be going on inside their heads at present but I don’t think it would be a very pleasant experience. Look at how it has effected Glen lately.
And where are the rest of the usual Lib posters. They have gone to ground and left poor old Glen to carry the can on their behalf. Where’s Tabitha when you need her?
The numbers in this poll are as new as any of the ideas that come out of 2020 summit!!
I agree with Glen the ALP has very little talent
Rudd, Gillard, Tanner, Combet, Shorton, Wong, Maxine
Sadly the Liberals are in as bad if not worst shape.
Glen I know plenty of people who like Julia and a lot of women think it’s fantastic that finally there is a really high ranking politician who’s female.
I should add Pilbersek to that list
It will be interesting to see if the government’s popularity is affected by the summit. Suspect the commentariat will switch to US politics for a couple of days. suggested visiting Voices Without Votes for some un-American and/or non-American views.
From the Oz
“Coalition down, Nelson up: Newspoll
BRENDAN Nelson has clawed his way back into double digits as the nation’s preferred PM but support for the Coalition has again fallen. ”
Clawed back to 10% ?!?!?!
oh the hilarity
36
Glen
Just Me – ask any jo blow they don’t like Gillard, even Labor supporters don’t like her or want her as leader!
That is not real evidence, Glen, and you know it.
The onus is firmly on you to provide some serious evidence of your claim about Gillard’s lack of popularity, such as a reputable poll. You can’t just assert it to be true, much as you might want it to be.
Looks like the Oz headline for tomorrows headline is
‘Costello leads Libs dream team’
good grief. I thats there dream, hey have bloody limited imaginations !
Gillard is very popular, she is no emily’s list candidate.
For what its worth, sceptic @25, Skyhooks actually sang : Ego is NOT a dirty word.
Gillard is very popular, she is no emily’s list candidate.
Though, IIRC, she is a member of Emily’s List.
FS @ 26 “the Liberals now have enough castrati on their benches to rival the Vienna Boys choir in shrillness”
Oh jeez FS, priceless, ROTFL, and so true.
Did anyone notice that Bill Heffernan was actively taking part in 2020 and making serious contributions. I must confess to a sneaking admiration for the Heifer, maybe I just like head-kickers but he seems ok to me. Unlike the castrati outlined in Fulvio’s post.
What are your thoughts on the most meaningless poll metric included in this Newspoll?
My vote goes to “Preferred Treasurer” (yes I know the summary says “Better Treasurer” but it also says “Better PM”). I’m pretty the “Preferred Treasurer” results in the lead-up to the last election had little to no impact on the result of that election.
That said, 29-35 is not a bad result for Swannie given the relative lack of name recognition.
Turnull/Robb would have to be a dream result for Labor supporters. It would confirm the problem for the Liberal party is that too many Liberals got re-elected at the last election. Has Robb the shadow foreign affairs minister made it out of Australia yet or has he stayed home sharpening knives for the post budget leadership stoush.
Hey Glen, still waiting for your ‘proof’ re Julia, she impresses me more every time I see her, as do most of the front bench.
Speaking of Julia, reminds me of this classic from Clarke and Dawe last November:
http://www.abc.net.au/7.30/content/2007/s2098073.htm
To be fair to Glen, Julia is very unpopular — in the Coalition ranks, because she makes them all look so silly.
Bloody lefty mag.
http://www.businessspectator.com.au/bs.nsf/Article/Winds-of-change-DW84S?OpenDocument
Morning all-
have not been very intersted in the local politcal scene for a while (having much more fun with the US elections), but seeing Smirk is going to dump them all in it even further should be a hoot.
I think Julia is unpopular, when you compare her to Kevin. Now, compared to Brendan, not so much.
Does anyone think the Liberals, in their desperation, would turn back to Howard? Amazingly, even after he lost them the election, he still has a considerable following, both within the party and voters-supporters.
If Turnbull turns out a dud (likely torn apart by the coming republic wedge, on top of his other intrinsic vulnerabilities) and Costello sulks his way into the sunset, and Hockey, Bishop, Abbott etc passed over – who else?
Howard is at a bit of a loose end these days and would not (I don’t think) would be able to resist the gig if offered to him.
Would they do it? Would he do it? …
36
Glen
I was speaking to to Joe Blow just yesterday and he said that Gillard would make a great PM. Joe’s experience is that she is very popular especially among working men and women.
So there you go Glen – you’re wrong again.
Nelson says people keep underestimating him. He was right (by 1%).
The other problem for the Libs is that it’s much easier to build a national profile quickly (in the event of a Leadership bus crash) from the Government benches.
As much as he’s hopeless, Morris Who went from unknown to re-election pretty darn quickly – becuase he was in charge and could build the profile quickly.
Gillard strikes me as similar is some ways – I think she would have almost no chance of winning from opposition, but if you give her the leadership with a decent time before the subsequent election (a la Anna Bligh, Morris Iemma, John Brumby….) then she could be very hard to beat. She’s just too competent. If she’s given the job and time to prove herself her overwhelming competence will ensure her re-election.
One of the problems of opposition is that this doesn’t hold true….
i’m still amazed how the oz just doesnt get how polls work, and they own Newspoll. When Nelson’s rating dropped to 7% they had a diatribe about how this was within the MOE, now it goes up from 9 to 10 and they are saying it is a claw back??
Great news for supporters of transparency, honesty and bitter revenge in politics, Peter Costello is going to publish his memoirs this year with Melbourne University Press. It should be an honest constructive dialogue, so helpful to coalition strategists wanting to know where to go next.
This from The Age:
“He will reveal how and why, despite a booming economy, the Liberals suffered a devastating defeat in 2007.”
See
http://www.theage.com.au/news/national/the-smirk-gets-set-to-spill/2008/04/22/1208742889526.html
I’m sure Brendan Nelson and Andrew Robb will find that very helpful.
Andrew
I suspect they know what they are writing, and why. Perhaps they will have an easier time explaining the by-election results later this year. Costello publishing his memoirs means that he is going for a start; he won’t front another question time once that piece comes out in print.
Asking the other questions cant do doing anything but destablise Nelson’s position- well done the OO!! Nelson has risen from FOURTH to THIRD on preferred leader! He is really making gains. And the Turnbull/Swan question is a nice touch- predictable result. The one question is: how did the Nelson/Bishop team get the highest %???? I guess because they are already a team??
“Peter Costello is going to publish his memoirs this year with Melbourne University Press”
If it is anything like his comments within the Howard biography it should be fun. So that should be close to a mid-term dump on Howard and his cronies that remain and probably means Costello wont be hanging around.
The public preference of either Swan and Turnbull is a superficial one.
People may tend to find Turnbull acceptable because he has a respectable appearance and looks the part. Swanny needs to start dressing in dark Italian suits and work on his speaking voice. The postion of Treasurer is mostly an acting role and all about persona and projection. Swan needs to work on his speech patterns as well, got to sound the part as well. Otherwise they sit and take instructions from Treasury and the PM and the resident power groups. Just ask Costello.
Keating was the last Treasurer who actually ‘Treasured’.
The pressure will be on Swan to improve his profile and approval with ‘his’ May Budget.
Ah, Glen. Hard times at present with the coalition. And there’s no respite for you even in the AFL the way the Demons are going.
While you and the coalition people think that Gillard’s unpopular, I fear the hard times will continue. There may be some aspects of Gillard that some people don’t like. My wife is at one with Mrs Bear over at Club Troppo about her hair. But support her, she certainly does. Don’t mistake her droll monotone for lack of effectiveness. She can and has been devastating.
Rudd wouldn’t keep giving her so much work if he had any doubts about her.
This is amusing, in an ironic kinda way:
http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,23578308-2702,00.html
Julia Gillard is one very smart woman and is a terrific asset to the Labor Party . Her ability to cut people into little pieces if the need arises is most entertaining. Just ask Barry Cassidy.
Glen, Whilst I admire your willingness to post here and mostly get beat up for it, your posts clearly reflect the problem with the Libs. Whilst you continue to believe that the problem is Rudd or Gillard (good try on that one) or the summit or labor policies, you will remain in the wilderness. Until and unless the Libs are prepared to dissect the real reasons for their defeat and change accordingly, these poll figures wont change much. The skill of Rudd as an opposition leader was to present a credible alernative, not just snipe and bicker for the sake of it.
And on another point, it’s funny how some in the MSM cannot simply accept that Rudd is not simply on a honeymoon. As far as ratings go, whether approval, 2PP or PPM he is a RECORD BREAKER both as opposition leader and PM.
I can see that there will be celebrations when one day the polls come down to 55/45 not realising that this figure is also terrible, reflective of the Howard/Beazle/Crean era.
Glen, if at anytime you can produce the evidence to show Gillard is unpopular I will believe you. Otherwise you are just making it up.
Andrew, i never said the problem with the Libs was Rudd. We have only ourselves to blame for the position we’re right now.
If Gary Newspoll ever do a satisfaction rating or PPM rating with Julia then ill be using that as proof. I assure you i am not making it up, how many Joe Blows would prefer Gillard over Rudd???
I still posit that things will probably get worse for us before they get better, according to media perceptions Nelson is our Crean so we’re having our Crean before our ‘Rudd’ which is probably better off happening.
Yes Don i suppose one could make a connection with the Coalition and the MFC, they both have trouble defining themselves well with the media and this makes people think they stand for nothing, they struggle when their main leaders go down or aren’t playing well (Neitz/Howard), they are both running out of money and both aren’t performing on the playing field (Parliament, MCG). Hence they’re both a basket case right now but hopefully it wont be like this forever.
But the ALP were just as pathetic as we are now at one stage, it just goes to show you things can get better if you try hard enough to sort yourself out and you’ve just got to wait awhile.
Andrew the real reasons we’re in the wilderness are clear cut to borrow a phrase….we ran down our State Divisions in order to keep a hold of Federal Government, we took no interest in helping out our State Divisions in becoming competitive against Labor and all the money and best candidates went into Federal Election campaigns. We were trapped having a highly successful and popular long serving Prime Minister so that when he could of gone, we weren’t prepared to split up when it might have helped us. And we made policy mistakes like Workchoices where we took away the no disadvantage test and opened ourselves up to attack.
But that really doesn’t matter now, we’ve just got to learn from our mistakes and carry on being the Opposition and wait about a decade probably.
Andrew # 68
You are correct. Rudd was a skilled and effective Opposition Leader. Juxtaposing him with the present (hapless) Opposition Leader is a bit disingenuous because Rudd’s timing was excellent: he came to the job at the right time in the electoral cycle and was adept enough to provide a very credible alternative to a government asking electors for a fifth term and with the same leader.
This really says it all………
http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/opinion/cartoons/
Glen @ 71.
And Work Choices! Flog yourself real hard over that one.
Glen at 71, whilst your focus on state divisions seems a very dubious reason for the current predicament, at least youve mentioned workchoices. What other policies did you get wrong? And what else did you do wrong? What do you think about the second order issues such as Haneef, Hicks, Iraq, AWB etc??
The libs so far have been happy to cling to the narrative of “we were just there too long, people wanted a change. we didnt actually do anything wrong”. This is, as you would say, bull butter. I know they are trying to protect the legacy/reputation of the Howard government, but it wont help them, shows them as out of touch, and insults voters
Australian voters are very conservative in terms of changing the government, and do not do so lightly, or for the sake of it. The libs should appreciate this and do some real soul searching. I think it might take at least another defeat for them to get to that point.
I really can’t see that we made any mistakes real big ones that is on any policy except Workchoices which had to have been done in our last term….I’m sure we made some mistakes every government does like Howard making Hollingsworth GG.
Iraq was not a mistake and i dont think we lost the election because of it.
Hicks was not our problem he got himself into that mess i dont see how any of that was our fault, and we did get him home in the end.
AWB was not our fault either, AWB were the ones doing the bribes and the ones covering it up the same thing could have happened to any government.
Haneef was a mistake, nevertheless he did have relatives who were terrorists it’s really the Queensland Governments fault for running down their health system that they have to recruit so many doctors from overseas in the first place.
The trouble is Labor’s route to Canberra was through winning the States, and we hold none. From the States we need to show we can Govern before the people will give us another shot in Canberra.
Glen 71
“…we’re having our Crean before our ‘Rudd’ …”
Your side doesn’t have a Rudd. In fact your side is Rudderless.
You keep talking about the opinions of Joe Blow. I see that as another way of saying “I have no evidence at all to support my claims.”
If you ever get your hands on such evidence please bring it to my attention. I don’t expect to hear from you on this subject for quite some time.
#71
Glen, you’ve become a bit slippery about Gillard. That most Joe Blows prefer Rudd to Gillard does not mean that Gillard is unpopular.
Well i can give you proof that Wayne Swan is unpopular….
That a Treasurer would have a rating of 29% is a joke…well Swan is a joke so i suppose it evens itself out lol!
When will Gillard or Tanner get the job???
I wonder how many voters the Liberals lost forever with WorkChoices – those who will not vote for them again for fear of what they might do with Industrial Relations.
The Liberals overlooked (or, in their arrogance, chose to ignore) a basic axiom of democracy – that government should be in fear of the people, never people in fear of their governments.
” … we’re having our Crean before our ‘Rudd’ …” sounds a bit premature. I expect to see a litany of pop-up leaders intoxicating us with neo-con love before your magical ‘Rudd’ arrives. (Mandrake ‘Rudd’ will probably appear among the spawn of Alex Hawke.)
Problem Number 1:
“I really can’t see that we made any mistakes, real big ones that is….”
What on earth are you going to do IF/WHEN Allbull, Costello or whoever shortcuts the downward spiral, says exactly the opposite of this? How are you going to post rationalise that?
Onimod your selective quoting underlies you extreme left wing bias. I admitted that our big mistake was Workchoices!
Is there a more electable Liberal Monarchist than Nelson? Downer is a laughing stock & Tony PeopleSkills shot himself in one foot by attacking Bernie Banton & the other by whining all over the Sunday Tabloids about the trials of living on a pittance of only c$120,000 py + perks.
BTW, did anyone else notice that the transcripts of the last two weeks’ “Insiders” panel discussions have not yet appeared?
Ah, Conspiracy Theories bubble to the surface!! Have some of the statements been too libelous / ridiculous to print?
You’d better wait for you hero Pete to lay it all out for you later this year – evidently you have no perspective nationally or internationally.
76. Revisionism at its best. And all said deadpan with a straight face.
Beautiful.
Glen, “Joe Blows” (or, for that matter, most of the ALP) might not (currently) prefer Gillard over Rudd; however …
Let’s unpack this in reverse order:
Rudd was elected less than 5 months ago (Ok, by a few days’ margin, but it’s still LESS than 5 mths). He is riding very high in the approval polls. He’d have to fall under that famous bus for Julia, or the ALP, or the voters, to change that.
In my reality, “Joe Blows” belong to my father’s generation (RIP – he remembered “the boys” marching to war in 1914) and the term wasn’t flattering even then (the slightly more flattering version reversed it to BlowJoe). JBs are the lowest common denominators – below Coves, Codgers & Blokes – so their lack of approval I’d take for granted, seeing they belong to a past predating Baby Boomers, Gen X & Gen Y. So I, too, would be surprised if many Joe Blows still alive would approve of Julia; but they are but a very very very small part of the national electorate.
Intelligent males of the last three generations, especially of the last two, have very different attitudes indeed. They voted strongly (GenX) and overwhelmingly (GenY) for a political party of which Julia Gillard is the PM in waiting – and that was DESPITE the very well beaten-up scare tactics of the Coalition and their supporters, both MSM and Blogsphere.
i was disappionted to hear that glenn milne was not helping costello write his tekk all
An Outsider’s Victory Allows Jubilant Paraguayans to Look Past Dictatorship
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/04/22/world/americas/22paraguay.html?ref=world
How desperate are the OO to get their Lib mates some publicity. Front page news is about polling re the coalition. Nobody gives a s#it about the useless pack of timewasters anymore and how that hurts the OO and ABC
I’m surprized the OO hasn’t gone into receivership by now.
Pathetic the lot of them.
76
Glen Says:
I really can’t see that we made any mistakes real big ones that is on any policy except Workchoices…
You go right on believing that, it will keep your side out for as long as you do.
Iraq was not a mistake and i dont think we lost the election because of it.
The bulk of the Australian population have always opposed the Iraq folly. It may not have been a deciding issue in the election, but it certainly didn’t help your side either.
Hicks was not our problem he got himself into that mess i dont see how any of that was our fault, and we did get him home in the end.
Oh puhleese. The government’s handling of the Hicks issue ended up costing them a lot of credibility.
AWB was not our fault either, AWB were the ones doing the bribes and the ones covering it up the same thing could have happened to any government.
You honestly believe that nobody in the government (let alone the relevant senior ministers) had any idea what was happening, or responsibility to find out?
Haneef was a mistake, nevertheless he did have relatives who were terrorists it’s really the Queensland Governments fault for running down their health system that they have to recruit so many doctors from overseas in the first place.
Wow, that is an impressive leap of logic.
The trouble is Labor’s route to Canberra was through winning the States, and we hold none. From the States we need to show we can Govern before the people will give us another shot in Canberra.
Labor won federal government despite also having all the states and territories, not because of it.
You seem to be suffering from the delusion that it was only one or two mistakes that cost the Coalition the election, and everything else was hunky-dory. It wasn’t. Not even close. Your side had well and truly worn out its welcome, for a number of reasons on a number of issues. Until your side grasp and acknowledge that, and make the necessary changes, they will suffer the irrelevancy of long term opposition.
79
Glen Says:
Well i can give you proof that Wayne Swan is unpopular….
That a Treasurer would have a rating of 29% is a joke…well Swan is a joke so i suppose it evens itself out lol!
Nice try to change the subject, NOT. You made the claim about Gillard’s alleged unpopularity, not Swan’s. Either produce the evidence or withdraw the claim.
As to Swan’s alleged lack of popularity, you might notice in those poll figures a very high number of uncommitted, 30%, and that the difference between Swan and Turnbull as preferred treasurer is just 6%, which is easily covered by the uncommitted. People (including me) are quite rightly holding their judgement until the budget, which I agree is a big test for Swan, as it is for any first time treasurer, (and it is also a test for the government in general).
Furthermore, all treasurers are unpopular, nobody likes the person who takes the tax and cuts the budgets (and they are typically cut in the first budget of an incoming administration). Costello’s popularity during his time as treasurer wasn’t exactly sky high either. A fairer comparison would be between Costello and Swan’s respective popularity just after delivering their first budgets.
A quote from Dr Nelson
“But the one thing that I will say is that Australians and Australian families that look at their children going from school to uni, to TAFE, to apprenticeships, to jobs, owe Peter Costello an enormous debt for what he’s done over the last 12 years in particular, but throughout his public life, to make the country what it is today.”
How dare he insist that people of Australian have any debt with any politician, be they Liberal or Labor. This is exactly the reason why they, the Libs, were rocketed into the political junk yard. This honestly makes me sick…. I might even put a call into his office to ask how one actually goes about paying this “debt” back to Costello.
Glen, I maybe doing you a disservice here but don’t you argue that Gillard is unpopular generally, not just compared to Rudd? If that is not the case then we are talking about two different things. I’d bet good money, at the moment that people would prefer Rudd over Gillard as PM but I don’t believe Gillard is unpopular generally.
Just Me, expect no response or justification, just a repetition of the same rhetoric ad nauseum.
Let’s wait and see what sort of budget Swan comes up with before we condemn him, right Glen?
How soon before there’s a byelection for Higgins? Captain Smirk is obviously getting out soon!
“all treasurers are unpopular” ahh JustMe then how do you explain Costello’s approval rating as Treasurer being so high??
His PPM rating may have been low as compared to Howard but he was not an unpopular Treasurer, mainly because he’d put the economy back on the right track and produced more spending and tax cuts while at the same time maintaining a significant surplus!
http://www.smh.com.au/news/national/voters-dread-costello-switch-poll-finds/2007/06/03/1180809340753.html
Any other revisionist fluff you want to put on the table for ridicule?
Nelson claims that because Rudd opposed the GST he isn’t really interested in comprehensive tax reform. So every reform must be good and must be supported or you don’t really want reform?
97
onimod – if you are going to quote me quote me correctly please.
“His PPM rating may have been low as compared to Howard but he was not an unpopular Treasurer…”
So how is what i said revisionist??
Triton Rudd said GST first day in operation was national injustice day but now he supports it…hmm seems a little two faced to me.
Gotta compare like with like, Glen. What was Costello’s rating before (and after) his first budget?
Just Me you cannot compare like with like not with first budgets…
Costello had a 10b black hole and 96b dollars of debt, high inflation, high unemployment and high interest rates to contend with.
Swan has 13-16b surplus 0 net debt and billions in savings, moderate inflation, moderate interest rates and low unemployment.
Sorry but who has the easier ride????
That’s it – let’s get all the way down to earwax….
How about the first shred of evidence of Costello’s popularity you’re going to claim, and in the style that you’ve made all your own, provided no evidence whatsoever.
Might be safer for you to change the subject again, and again, and again….
That depends whose propaganda you believe, Glen.
“Costello’s attractions are that he is younger than Howard, yet very experienced. His approval rating as Treasurer, according to an earlier Nielsen poll, was an impressive 70 per cent.”
http://www.smh.com.au/news/apec/why-theyd-be-mad-to-switch-horses-now/2007/09/09/1189276546444.html?page=2
So just half a year ago Peter Costello had an approval rating as Treasurer of 70% and Wayne Rooster Swan has an approval rating of 29% lol!
Gotta hand it to you Glen you make everyone else look good.
Glen,
We’ll find out tomorrow afternoon just how moderate inflation is…
In June 1996 year-ended inflation was 3.1%. It will be at least 3.8% tomorrow, if not higher.
Well done – a piece of evidence! That’s the first step. You’ll need to make a habit of that for a start.
Now to the analysis. [This requires you to go over to the other corner and put on the perspective hat.....]
That vital treasurer approval rating translates/translated into what exactly?
Glen you’re laughing at Swans approval rating. Have you noticed Nelsons approval rating?
It must have slipped by your notice.
http://news.theage.com.au/ok-for-costello-to-pen-memoirs-nelson/20080422-27t9.html
“Opposition Leader Brendan Nelson has rejected criticism of former treasurer Peter Costello for writing his memoirs on taxpayers’ time.
Shareholder activist and commentator Stephen Mayne, who ran against Mr Costello for the Melbourne seat of Higgins, on Tuesday said Mr Costello should not be taking a “six-figure advance” to write a book while he is also collecting a six-figure taxpayer-funded salary to be an MP.
“I was surprised to hear that he might be writing it while still in the parliament,” Mr Mayne told ABC radio.
But Dr Nelson on Tuesday backed Mr Costello’s pending memoirs.
“I think it is more than appropriate for Peter Costello to write his memoirs while he is sitting in parliament, of course it is,” he told reporters in Melbourne.
“I mean, for goodness sake, Peter Costello has served Australia in public life for 18 years.
“His family has made enormous sacrifices.
“Has he earned his right to write his memoirs?
“You’re damn right he has,” Dr Nelson said.
Ahhh, so that’s what representing your electorate means – I wasn’t quite sure
Glen, keep clutching at those few straws you have left! All is not lost, Nelson’s approval rating is up a staggering 1% LOL
Has anyone noticed how the “popular teasurer” is now an opposition backbencher while the “unpopular treasurer” is the treasurer? I’m sure Costello is so pleased he was so popular and Swan is so disappointed.
Costello’s, Turnbull’s and Swan’s approval ratings are decided by mostly people who know little about what is going on and pay little attention to politics. They go by impressions and are mostly unaware of technical abilities.
Approval ratings are not always an indication of quality but of the image recieved by the general pulic. Rudd’s current stellar ratings indicate that the public have nothing to rate him against as the image the opposition are projecting is terrible.
Costello’s 70% approval rating was based on his ability to project an image and also due to the image that Howard had developed over a decade.
Swan could be tens times more competent as a Treasurer than Costello but it wont necessarily show up in the polls due to his poorer image projection.
We need to remember this is the general public we are talking about, not a room full of bankers, economists and business leaders.
Spot on – see 112.
Progressive that move of 1% could be just MOE difference from the last poll anyway. It doesn’t matter the media say Nelson is unpopular and the polls reflect this there is little Brendan can do about it.
I can just picture Swan practicing his speech over and over and over and over again because u know he’ll make a meal of it, what with his shifty manner at the dispatch box and basically blaming the Coalition for ever problem they face and exaggerating the inflation ‘problem’. Break out the popcorn for Swan’s Budget address it will be a laugh a minute pity i wont be here to see that happen.
I’m sure the homeowners who are suffereing the higher mortgage rates appreciate the inverted commas Glen.
Inflation is a real problem.
Most people don’t fully understand, but they understand that inflation is realy high because Howard (And Costello) let it get there and that high inflation causes interest rates to rise…..
That’s only partly true, but it’s a damning narrative. One that Swan and Rudd will capitalise on. Beazley’s Black hole is not even remotely true.
Did you know that debt was LOWER when the ALP left office than what they inherited from the Liberals in 1983? (Inflation adjusted).
Come off it Glen, Costello was a master at blaming the previous government. I don’t recall you criticising him for doing that. As for Swan’s performance, laugh all you like, it should be the first of many. His performance should be very smooth by the time he leaves the job. Anyone remember what Costello’s first budget presentation was like? Did anyone watch it?
It’s 19% more than “just call me Brendan”. If Nelson’s rating was that good he would not be under the pressure he is now. Lets see how both rate after the budget.
My guess would be Swan going up and Brendan down if that is possible.
Cossie is going to write his memoirs. How exciting – not! The only thing more boring would be Howard’s memoirs. In the SMH today he says: “I think it’ll be a very positive contribution, of where we were, how far we’ve come, where we ought to go in the future and what actually happened over the last two decades,” The word positive and Cossie are a contradiction in terms. It will be a moan about how that bully John refused to give him a go as PM and how he would have been a great PM if only he had the guts to stand up to the bully Howard. The book will be on the $5 table at the book shop within a month.
“…there is little Brendan can do about it”
Are you referring to Brendans charisma, talent, ability, intellectual capacity or all of the above?
Are you going to suggest that the Australian Parliamentary system, and thus the power of the leader of the opposition, is dominated intellectually and politically by the media? [Sure the political press can be rough, but they're hardly a skilful or intelligent lot]
Who are you going to blame next?
Feel free to chose your next subject from the bottom of the deck.
By the way. The 29% is a preferred treasure not a satisfaction rating.
112
Gary Bruce
Exactly.
“Costello was a master at blaming the previous government”
But Gary can you blame him for the mess he had to sort out after Keating i mean let’s get serious here.
Yes Keating made some important reforms in the 1980s i wont begrudge him that but look at the state of the economy Costello received in 1996 i think he was well within his rights of blaming the previous government for not maintaining the economy.
Ebenezer you wouldn’t prefer a Treasurer that you weren’t satisfied with!
I just love the way Glen brings out the talent on this site. Without Glen this site would not be half as good.
The way he gently teases the information out of everyone.
No,No,No, Glen! There’s no need to get that desperate.
I’m sure with a bit of counselling, every thing will be ok.
Maybe you should contact “Beyond Blue” pronto. You could probably get an appointment straight after Nelson’s.
No no it’s just that i will be out of the country for 4 months from early May.
So somehow this blog will have to survive without a die-hard Tory for 4 months…i think you can manage but i wonder if Nelson will still be around when i get back???
Don’t go Glen, all is forgiven.
Given the circumstances politically I don’t know how you keep your sense of humour Glen. Good on you.
I’m sure Nelson will still be in Parliament!! It’s hard to completely shake off those Liberals….
Maybe we could get Andrew Bolt to stand in for you, so we don’t feel neglected.
I will have to get an update on all things political once i get back in mid September.
Though i suspect it will have a red tinge to it, but i will take that into account but i can basically take a guess what will happen. Mr Turnbull will probably be leader by then.
Once you go Glen, William may as well shut this site down.
We might all have to move over to Bolter’s site and see if we can sort it out.
Scorpio, you’ll now attract a self rightuous diatribe about poking fun at the depressed…..
By the way Glen Swan is dealing with Costello’s gutlessness at keeping Howard’s prolific spending down – hence the rise in inflation and interest rates in the last couple of years.
FS, it’s totally understandable that people of the “right” persuasion would be feeling depressed at the moment.
The polls since December 2006 have not exactly been the type that would lead to cheerfulness and optimism.
Looking further into the future, Glen appears to be at realistic about which way they will go. Flatlining.
Well when the ALP took over they were at the same level as when they were in 1996 i think, but we had high unemployment, just suffered a recession and had a 10b budget deficit and 96b of debt. Rudd and Swan have no budget deficit no net debt and low unemployment.
The ALP are very lucky to have taken over now with the economy going so well and the budget so much in the black. They’re as lucky as Bracks was in 1999 when he got Kennett’s savings and could spend up big which he did.
Glen, where are you off to? You’re not heading over to help out the GOP inn the upcoming US elections are you?
Glen, where are you off to? You’re not heading over to help out the GOP in the upcoming US elections are you?
To be fair Glen, and all jokes aside, Howard and Costello had remarkably little to do with that.
Notice all the states are running surpluses and that the price of Australia’s main exports have increased so much it is a “once in a generation” opportunity.
yip yip farkin yip
Bushfire Bill… You get what I mean
137 Glen – I take your point on the degree of difficulty but it is nonetheless a very difficult time economically for Swan and the Libs can’t wash their hands totally of their role in this. Hell, your side are hoping for a bounce in the polls because the budget will be tough. To me that is not a sign of great economic times.
Glen, in ‘95-’96 Australia had a very strong economy (GDP) growing at %4pm and inflation at %3 and under control and housing interest rates at %8.5 to %9 and going down, that was after a World recession in 1990 and Australia’s housing interest having hit a high of %17 in 1989. The Australian Government debt of $90b was well below it being a problem, as was shown how easy it was for the Howard government to be able to ‘pay it off’, as much of it was paid for by the privitisation of many government assets. The Hawke/Keating goverments did many reforms including tax, deregulation of financial institutes, workforce/labour reforms (Individual Contracts). They did also look at a GST but because of already the people where reform fatigued and hated the idea of a new tax, with the welfare lobby, the union movement and the general public against it they dropped it.
Please Glen, stop the continued lie of Howard and his hatred Keating.
Oh, and the surplus is thanks to China and India.
Australia is not and never has been run by some one like Mugabe.
William, sorry about the double post.
Could you please delete 138?
141 classified
agreed – should know better
140
Rates Analyst – If that is the case why are so many States in the Red and running up large debts?
Scorpio the US is one place i shall be visiting but ill be spending just as much time in Canada and the UK.
Because they finally realised that Govenrments need to build infrastructure – not just sell it.
Have you caught a train recently? That’s a neat summary of the problem. If State Government’s had invested more in Transport, commuting wouldn’t be the massive drag on productivity it is today.
More unity.
A bitter split within the Coalition has intensified over the Government’s plans to end the single-desk wheat marketing system.
http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2008/04/22/2224351.htm
Whatever happened to smirks debt truck? It turned into a debt train with a squillion carriages following on.
Who is right, Turnbul says no significant tax reform since the GST, Smirk says he did plenty of reform. Ho hum.
So Glen, you’d prefer the states to not go into very manageable debt to pay for very necessary infrastructure projects so they can keep just in the black? How do you suppose they pay for this necessary work Glen?
Of course the fact that they are running budget surpluses doesn’t count does it Glen?
Glen, have you googled what interest rates were in 1996 and what they are now?
Glen,
Whaddya reckon about Cossie bludging all day in and out of parliament and on the public teat? Under Workchoices, that would have been ample reason to dismiss. At least we now what he has been doing with that laptop! What a guy! Doesn’t have the cojones to get into the private sector and never had the pills to take on Howard. Say what you like about Keating, but his “I’m coming after you, Bob” line, followed by defeat and then riding the back bench pine until the time was right showed who had the ticker. In other words, he didn’t have the numbers but he still took on the boss. All of which was a million miles from the Cos, then, now and all times in between..
And, being a South Sydney Rabbitoh supporter, I share your bleeding over the Melbourne Demons. Not even Russell Crowe wants to be photographed with them these days! We, being now the richest Sydney team, have bucketloads of money to spend and a lot of talent sitting in underfunded hospital wards so there is light at the end of the tunnel. Is there any hope for the Dees?
I hope you enjoy your trip. Stay away from political blogs. A week may be an eternity for the Bunnies and the Demons but you might even be pleasantly surprised by what may happen during your four month absence. But I doubt it…
Well Roy at least there is more to life than football, there’s politics oh damn it all lol!
So it seems that the Libs and Nats are going to vote as separate parties in the senate on the wheat thingo.
The agrarian socialists want a controlled market – evil socialists. The Libs want something else.
It is just too much fun to watch.
I’m very entertained by the debate about preferred Treasurer figures, and indeed what will Pollbludgers be without Glen? But, really, 61/39 TPP. I’m surprised there hasn’t been more discussion of how really dreadful, awful, wrist slashingly depressing this must be for the LNP and why they persist with what is clearly a very, very stupid tactic of trying to paint Rudd as lacking in substance and reliant on spin. Do they not notice Rudd’s continuing stratospheric PPM figures. Do they not notice disastrous 2TPP figures? Do they not know how to do anything else?
ruawake 154, the different power bases of the LNP, as described by Possum, at each other’s throats, as could reasonably be predicted. There’s much fun to be had. And the Smirk writing his book on taxpayer funded time (ghost written by his father in law who described Howard as a megalomaniac just after the defeat, sniggle), and defended by (you know I’m a doctor) Nelson?
Seriously, Glen, before you decamp on your trip, you might point out to your colleagues that they really are making the most terrible impression. Preferred Treasurer ratings? Pfft!
Costello will probably put the Advance for his book, into his superannuation fund and receive tax free income, as he changed the law re returns for superannuation last year. The biggest give away to the wealthy of all time.
Sort of makes you think about the liberal party.
http://www.williamirwinthompson.org/blog.html
The worst thing to happen to politician’s superannuation was Mark Latham.
He went for the populist line of bashing Federal politicians early release of super, pressured JWH to bring it into line with other occupations, and then cleaned up on the early release of his super when he quit.j
So Mr Squiggle you do not agree with what Latham did? unsure..
At least he had the courage to do something about it…
Read his book Mr Squiggle you may understand why he quit.
So Glen are you telling us that you will not have access to teh intertubes while you are away. Bugger. Perhaps we can all chip in and buy you one of them new-fangled dongley thingys or a carrier pidgeon even, the site just will not be the same without bull butter dollops.
‘The biggest give away to the wealthy of all time.’
I remember when pensions were first restricted to those in need of them. It was when McMahon resigned his seat and attention was brought to the fact he claimed the old age pension on top of his very generous super payout.
The libs saw the pension as a right for everyone regardless of income and assests, Whitlam brought in a means test to restrict it to those in need.
Howard and Costello’s tax changes effectively take us back to McMahons era and before, where even the uber rich can claim a pension, however as pointed out they go further and take it back to the 40’s when there was no income tax, but only for those able to arrange their affairs right of course.
Glen at 127 youve made my day. Could you get a replacement to give some intelligent debate from the Torie viewpoint or is that an oxymoron?? LOL
At least you balance things out a bit I guess
Hi Marky Mark,
I don’t care why Latham called it a day, I’m just glad that he did…
The greatest release valve that was available to politicians on all sides in Australia was the early access to Superannuation benefits.
It gave pollies who found themselves in conflict with their own party on an issue the ability to say “take this job and shove it”.
It was one of the great features of Australian politics, personal financial issues were removed from the decision to take part in representative politics. Nowadays, the chance to be an elected representative of Australians is something only the independently wealthy will pursue. (Turnbull, Garrett, Cornes etc)
From the moment that early access to superannaution benefits was removed, the liklihood of an “everyman” entering national parliament was reduced.
Speaking of pensions and the social security bill, I seem to recall the former Treasurer (some would say the greatest of all time) going on national television fairly early in his tenure warning the nation of the increased burden of the aged pension etc in the coming years and yet several budgets later IMHO made it a lot easier for the more affluent to hop on the gravy train for a share of the social security pie thus increasing the burden on future taxpayers exponentially.
Have a look at the Newspoll Graphic linked from WB’s into or here:
http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/files/newspoll-22apr.pdf
The damn funniest thing [thanks Karen Middleton] is the variation between the population at large and coalition’s supporters in their support for the Costello, Allbull team:
population in general – 27% (21% uncommitted – 48% the other 2 options)
coalition supporters – 38% (15% uncommitted – 57% the other 2 options)
So – not only deluded, but committed to being deluded
The age demographic is the are I find the most interesting, but given that I’ve got an interest in demography that’s not surprising.
18-34 like Costello as a leader more than the older generations by some margins. those older generation like Allbull – what a demographic to base your support
on… though it there’s not a significant demographic weighting in his numbers.
And yes – the Libs hate Swan more than the ALP supporters love him. As I pointed out earlier in the day, the Treasurer’s number have precious little effect on peoples voting intentions overall and there are a fair number of uncommited.
Tony /Abbott isn’t even a blip on the radar, though you don’t have to be much of a blip – see Nelson.
I’d rather see Nelson’s numbers by party supported, the same as the treasurer’s numbers. You know Newspoll has them. You know Nelson has them. You know Minchin has them.
Can you guess why they’re not showing them?
Interesting way of looking at it, thanks for such an analysis made me think a little about your views something which happens here infrequently. Nonetheless i do not entirely agree although i can understand your reasoning.
I do not think that this decision has made politics less interesting for people to become politicians.. If this was the case than i don’t think people such as Combet or Shorten would not have decided to become members. Everyman people don’t actually get into politics anyway as politics and getting preselected is about factional deals ( number cruncing) and who you know.
Nonetheless this notion that people will not retire earlier well that to me is a good thing, hence politics should be about policies and action and not self interest and greed.
Here’s a good poll at the Australian:
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/story/0,25197,22073824-5013404,00.html
my suggestion is to vote for Brendon Nelson as opposition leader in ‘08,’09,’10,’11,’12, …. etc you get the drift
I find it interesting that support for Turnbull has dropped from 34% to 25% since December. The more they see of him…?
169 Kina
I’m not sure we have seen more of him.
I mean the overly concerned like us have watched him attempting to stick as many feet in to his mouth as he can, but as a shadow minister, I think his public profile has dropped markedly.
WB – are you keeping stats on things like this?
The Australian. Today’s News Tomorrow. Slant on the Costello memoirs. Depicted as a relaunch of Costello as leader.
Of the Opposition, I guess. Must be heartened by Newspoll, as well as disheartened by his lack of invitation into the private sector.
Not to mention his inability to carve out any kind of career off his own bat.
Remarkable, really, the trumpeted notion that the selfless politician could earn more in the private sector.
Probably thinks his book will do it.
To crikey whitey from the previous thread I read your comment incorrectly.
Accept my apologies for implicating you with my comment.
I retract absolutely any inference you were agreeing with Glen on the summit,
I however do not retract my comments about the summit.
I think life is too short to be taken in by propaganda, I strongly believe Rudd could have been a high ranking official in any regime reliant on public opinion.
Glen, I think, has comments that should be seriously considered and not discounted because he has waved the Coalition flag.
Democracy is about accepting varied points of view and integrating the good points into our beliefs.
Most of the time I do not agree with Glen but also most of the time I think other commentators on this site make unsubstantiated comment and feel confident because it fits to the current ALP policy.
I suggest we do not comment as robots aka the Labor Party is saying something therefore it is correct.
Let us be astute in what we support.
Accepted with appreciation, Colin.
I was wondering if Glen would like any of us to represent him, in his absence. In the spirit of debate.
Oh, for the days when The Poll Bludger wasn’t about partisan “debate”, but actually about informed discussion about new developments in actual electoral races…
Pray make your contribution, Rebecca.
Which current electoral race do you have in mind?
Your insight on the US Presidential candidacies would be most appreciated. Do you have any views on the longer term effect of the bitterness and rancour generated between the Obama – Clinton camps vis a vis the ultimate Republican – Democrat contest?
Or is it your view that one can discuss elections in isolation from politics and politicians, discuss possible electoral outcomes without reference to the past incompetence or otherwise of the protagonists?
If that were so we would be engaged in discussion on political theory, not elections or electoral races as apparently is so close to your heart.
Of course if you were a Liberal Party supporter that may, in the present climate, be your better option.
@169-170
Turnbull’s “drop” is more likely a result of Peter Costello’s name being back in the mix.
#99 Glen
When you say Rudd “supports” the GST do you mean that he now believes it was a good decision or only that he won’t undo it now that it’s done? Some changes just cannot be easily reversed, so future governments are stuck with them.
If Rudd was true to his word he’d have scrapped the GST. He called it’s induction National Injustice Day…now he could of done it if he wanted to or at least reduced it hell the Tory PM of Canada reduced their GST so Rudd has shown himself to not stand by his own beliefs.
Trent C at 92, I agree completely on that outrageous quote from Dr Nelson.
Besides which the only “enormous debt” Australians owed in relation to education and training in the last 12 years I am aware of is the HECS/HELP debt.
Oh bullbutter Glen!
That damned GST is hard to remove, would have to increase income tax up the whole damned scale–political suicide!
While on the subject of the damned GST, we were the last nation to adopt this evil regressive tax, so there was a ton of precedent and experience to draw on. Yet Costello managed to bring in the worst damned GST in the world!
One aspect is the bloody high compliance cost!
What I would love to see Rudd/Swan do is remove the tax from businesses with sales under $400,000 or so. At that level they will have an accountant fulltime or at least half time.
When it was brought in one of my employees, on about $550/week got a wopping $11/week tax cut. Then the landlard came for his $100 rent–and charged $10 GST. It is a shit of a tax brought in totally incompetently!
Oh I hope Costello takes the leadership of the Libs–they will never, ever get back in power!
Hmmm “At that level they” should read “Businesses with that level of sales”
178 Glen – Rudd has stuck by his word. He said last election he would not alter the GST. If he did you and your fellow Libs would be screaming that he has broken a promise.
I’ll title this economic skill:
http://news.theage.com.au/may-interest-rate-hike-5050-economists/20080423-280w.html
“The headline CPI rose 1.3 per cent in the March quarter, for an annual rate of 4.2 per cent.”
You just knew it was going to be bad – Allbull et al said the opposite last week.
Now the pain is really going to kick in. Anyone who thought they could keep their house by scraping by and waiting for the interest rate fall early next year is going past the supermarket for razor blades tonight.
This is very sad for those people and this cultural economic background is going to make it hard for the Rudd government to undertake reform in many areas.
Thanks Pete; thanks John.
A quick scan of the comments sections in various publications show that this issue is causing major angst and confusion.
The reasons given and blame attributed shows that there is a fundamental misunderstanding of economic issues in the community, despite their obvious popularity. That’s got to be frustrating for the RBA and is a real indictment on our education system.
Thomarse, GST isn’t payable on rent… I hope your employee checked the Tax Act and got stuck in to the landlord.
As a contractor with sales under $400k I’d lose out if I didn’t collect GST. I get to claim 100% of the GST component of my business expenses (by deducting it from the collected GST I pay to the ATO.). If I wasn’t registered that would revert to being a tax deduction, and I’d only get a rebate based on my marginal rate.
The compliance costs are minimal because I’m already crunching most of these numbers to supply for my income tax return anyway.
So much for inflation genie not being out the bottle! Vindication for Swanny who shows himself being much more realistic than Allbull
186
But according to Allbull if he hadn’t mentioned it we wouldn’t have noticed it and the problem would have evaporated on it’s own…..
Long term, I reckon the inflation figure could just possible be the new go-to economic measure to replace the 17% interest rate figure in the mind of the populace. Economically we’re back to 1991 on inflation.
My anecdotal evidence says that real estate has been hit very very hard in my area.
From the SMH website:
“Other Liberals said Mr Costello had squibbed past chances to become leader and would not be accepted now.
“A great leader has a second-class mind and a first-class temperament. Peter has a first-class mind and a second-class temperament,” one of his colleagues said.”
With colleagues like that …..
Will Penny Wong be out of ministry?
http://www.news.com.au/comments/0,23600,23583382-5009760,00.html
Yes Virginia there is a Santa Claus.
http://www.news.com.au/couriermail/story/0,23739,23586671-5003402,00.html
190
Gary Bruce
Gary, Those inbreeds really are a disgrace. As much as I dislike Howard I would suggest there’s a stronger case for him to receive some sort of gong than a member of the royal family. The soon this country grows up and becomes a republic the better.
Stev K,
Give him nothing and take him nowhere. Harsh but fair.
And Costello’s approval rating as treasurer now is 0%.
190 – The people tipping Howard for that job are the same type that thought that Menzies was going to become UK PM in 1941. Just not living in the real world.
Dozens of frothing Liberals blaming their party’s legacy of high inflation on the new Labor government.
http://www.news.com.au/comments/0,23600,23585588-2,00.html
I note with a degree of disappointment, though not surprise, that the editor there chose not to publish my comment.
PS: Hey everyone, did you know Alexander Downer has his own blog. LOL
http://www.alexanderdowner.com.au/Pages/Headlines.aspx?SectionID=28
Crispy
Technically you are correct there is not GST on rents – but there is GST on what a real estate agent charges the landlord as fees. This of course is added on to the rent charged to the tenant – making rents higher.
Business does not pay GST but they have expenses in collecting and accounting for it.
It will be interesting to see how the court case goes, maybe millions of GST dollars will have to be repaid.
Problem for the Libs is that everyone knows that interest rates and inflation came from them and had been on the march since the 2004 election.
And Turnbull keeps making a fool of himself trying to say that inflation is a just a Labor promoted myth. Does the man know anything about anything – how far from the facts can you get?
What a great economic duo – Turnbull in permanent denial over inflation and Brendan who has sympathy for those poor bankers who have to sell up peoples homes (but nothing to do with interest rates or inflation of course).
Costello is shutting up because he has nothing to say now that he can’t be briefed by Treasury and ‘act’ as though he might know something about finance.
The idea of Costello being a good leader for the Liberals might actually be a myth based on his utterings as supporting actor to Howard. Actually having to step out to center stage might reveal there is nothing there. He certainly didn’t give any great impression when Howard made them a double-act during the election.
Nelson and Turnbull both have the habit of hoof in mouth statements.
Gotta admire the moral calibre of the ardent Liberal …
http://www.news.com.au/comments/0,23600,23585588-2,00.html
Turnbull is trying to pin inflation on Swan – no logic just politics. His argument is that inflation is bad because Swan says its bad.
Swans argument is that inflation is bad because Howard spent like a drunken sailor and did not comprehend productivity and infrastructure.
I wonder who will win the economic debate?
ruawake 199
Turnball is being portrayed as the economic “genius” by Liberals and Media. What are his quals? – I think Banking and Law and that he is a wealthy man.
Bankers only see the issue from 1 angle and their processes are always set up so that they always win. Wealth can be gained from just being in the right spot at the right time.
He is putting too much emphasis on the confidence factor re talking up or down the economy. Prices of goods etc are subject to the overiding dynamics of the market.
As normal Turnball’s abilty is far less than his reputation.
I think Swan will bring in the right budget with Treasury advice and with Rudd’s general oversight.
No 200
I think you underestimate Turnbull. He is not some heir to massive wealth. He is all self-made and has the economic talent to bring the Libs back.
If anything Swan is even less qualified. He’s never run a business, never been in the real world apart from the pampered bastion of communism that is university academia.
Simply no one has a clue how or what the future of the economy will be.
Last week the all or most economists were tipping a interest rate cut this year or next now they are tipping a rate rise sometime this year.
They also tipped no recession in 1989 and look what we got..
And what is the solution to the problem interest rates, and who does this affect – the poor, who generally are renters and first home owners. Tax rises should occur on the rich to slow the economy down because it is the rich through their speculation and spending which is causing the bust.
Spare us the socialist dogma marky marky. The reckless spending is coming from lower and middle Australia.
So the negative gearers are poor people and buying up of luxury goods are poor people… In part the poor are buying but the rich are buying big and the poor should have to cop it.
I will say it again interest rate rises benefit the rich and hurt the battlers.
It is not the way to slow the economy down especially when the results take a while to show.
The battlers are hurt for their own good, otherwise inflation would hurt them more.
Inflation will continue to rise in the years to come best to get use to it.
Oil and Food will continue to rise due to shortages, lucky the dollar is high because it is keeping import prices adjustments lower.
I am concerned about fighting it and we are going about incorrectly, why should battlers have to take the blame. I ask what wage increases have they had compared to our CEOs’ who have very nicely in the last few years along with property speculators.
Sorry do not agree with you but you are entitled to your view.
I wonder how the Australian Population would cope with food and fuel rationing again? Not very well me thinks. But then again they have readily signed up for water restrictions, despite there being alternatives.
Not that I want to go into that topic again.
The topic concerning whether tank water is clean, and i know if the settings are right it can be used for drinking water.
200 GP
I am not underestimating Turnball. I know he did not inherit his wealth but I also know that one can be “self made” by being in the right place at the right time. I just have not seen any evidence of his so-called talent in the Public Arena. He starts off with energy but quickly dies away when faced with a serious obstacle. He does not seem to be a stayer. While Swan may not yet be the greatest Parliamentary performer yet I felt he had Turnball’s measure as he adjusted to the new role. However this has no bearing either way on his ability to develop a budget – this is a separate issue.
Turnball was unimpressive as the Environment Minister under Howard.
It is Swan the Liberals are underestimating. The actual budget will be the test.
If the Libs think they can “claw back” significantly at budget time I suggest they will be disappointed. The Libs are a “one trick pony” and they will find this devastating if this happens.
My cousin in law is ’self made’ and he’s an absolute dolt. He’s stupid and conservative and with the right mates that’s been enough in the last decade of boom times in financial services. [I'd rather my brain and education over his money any day]
I don’t know Allbull personally, but enough people have told me he’s pretty paper thin on the intelligence front. Great when well briefed, terrible when he’s not. Not that different to Costello really.
Are we still waiting for the ’sure thing’ bounce from last years Liberal budget?
They’re not even involved in this one and yet they’re counting on a positive for them??? What does that say….they’re a better party in opposition at budget time!
The claw back, if it happens, is likely to be due to the same ignorant group of voters who flip sides at the drop of a coin because they don’t understand what the hell is going on. They’ll be flipping plenty of times between now and the next election.
MM 202
The Economists do not even agree with each other. It cannot be an exact science. Both Right and Left can use Economists to support their own arguments.
Both rich and poor will recklessly spend- the rich in taking an excessive risk just to gain a bit more money, and the poor on maybe household items which they cannot afford. But I do not think we can have a society totally subject to the dog eat dog free market and one that lacks compassion. There needs to be some control and some regulation. The Howard era produced some unreal hopes by politicans continually talking up the economy and some people got caught.
Unfortunately in the short term the only way to reduce inflation is by interest rates.
I would prefer somewhat more intensity and purpose from my Government. For which I voted. For which I hope so much of.
I know it is early days, but I really want some action, and it is not about the hardly life changing issue of the republic, it is about water, climate change, food management, viable production.
Nothing else matters as much as how are we to survive. Food, you know. Water.
Any thought of other as the foremost issue is fun, for some, who do not get it.
I find it funny that Hoof-In-Mouth has a thesis that talking about inflation creates it.
Sort of – ‘don’t talk about it or you will bring bad luck’ or ‘inflation is only bad if you call it bad’ – or ‘you only have high inflation if you call it high inflation.’ Inflation is semantics for Allbull but real for people just hanging in there. It is right up there with his $10m for a rain making machine.
Sure, when the poorer crowed spend a few dollars more on items it is inflation – because there are a whole lot more of them. The richer crowd because they are the smaller number can say their spending has no effect so they don’t have to rein in spending or their income increases. But the poorer crowd being greater in number can have the last laugh – they can change the government (when they are properly informed by the media of the facts). Which means the richer crowd have to at least pay some attention to the not-haves – throw a few bones as it were.
B.S. Fairman Says: @ 207,
We might have to sooner than we think.
http://www.voanews.com/specialenglish/2008-04-22-voa4.cfm
And this is not just in poorer countries either. Japan, which imports most of its food is suffering shortages. Supermarkets have run out of butter and other dairy products which they import from Australia. The drought here has had a big effect .
Many countries are suffering grain shortages as more grain is used for biofuels and the price skyrockets.
http://www.abc.net.au/pm/content/2008/s2225758.htm
Jen Says at 54:
[have not been very interested in the local politcal scene for a while (having much more fun with the US elections), but seeing Smirk is going to dump them all in it even further should be a hoot].
Jen at 54, it is very well to have fun, but to be disinterested in your local, I must say, is not good enough. You do live here after all. And have more influence here. In your country.
I am, and so should we all be, at least as interested and engaged with the local happenings.
And not about the former Government. About the present Government.
PS: Hey everyone, did you know Alexander Downer has his own blog. LOL
http://www.alexanderdowner.com.au/Pages/Headlines.aspx?SectionID=28
It looks like the blog has been hacked, still it is a funny read, in the style of blogs that used to parody Howard’s diary and others.
Hence my 213, Scorpio.
Alan Ramsey is perfect, as always, in capturing the mood of the nervous, me that is.
http://www.smh.com.au/news/opinion/krudd-and-co-know-an-idea-when-they-see-it/2008/04/18/1208025473737.html
It looks as though HRC is aiming to be the next Maggie Thatcher.
“I want the Iranians to know that if I’m the president, we will attack Iran,” Senator Clinton told ABC News when asked what she would do as president were Iran to launch a nuclear attack on Israel. “In the next 10 years, during which they might foolishly consider launching an attack on Israel, we would be able to totally obliterate them,” she said.]
http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,23582626-601,00.html
Thank goodness that we got rid of John Howard. He would have been right into something like this.
Crikey, like you, I don’t think the average Aussie realises just how profound the ramifications may be if this country is badly affected by climate change and further water shortages on a grander scale.
Did anybody ever do any rational analysis with biofuel? It would stand to reason that it could never be the solution/replacement for oil. Oil is energy dense right from the get go. How much corn or biomass and land etc is required to match a liter of oil?
Instead of using all that corn for biofuel they better start sending it to those places short on food/rice.
Time to bite the bullet before this gets too much worse – invest in renewable at least as a compliment to existing fossil fuels – better we charge our cars from a solar/geothermal/wave etc source than a half an acre of corn.
And ethanol, always reminds me of Honan, Manildra and Howard.
So, Scorpio at your 222, what is your assessment of the 2020 address of the solutions?
For me, I thought rather poor. I heard a hell of a lot more this morning on Bush Telegraph of such matters. And proposals and actions regarding food supplies.
Ramsey : “I won’t tell you my opinion of all this expensive wankery.”
I think he just did.
Well it seems Rudd should resign and hand over to Nelson as he is not saving the world properly yet.
Ramsey does have a point, Kina. I don’t think he is suggesting Nelson is the saviour. I actually want some action, on Kev’s part, as I said. I think you missed Ramsey’s purpose. Deliberately.
And about the biofuels, the immediately decelerated the better. The more I hear of, which is a great deal, employing cropping land for biofuels in favour of food production, is a nightmare. I see mass starvation. While we get to drive our cars.
We surely must all have heard that people are rioting already over staple shortages and prices, in countries with either little supply or unaffordable prices.
Unlike ours, so far.
Doesn’t the whole biofuel mess demonstrate that overnight solutions to problems often cause unforeseen problems down the track?
Didn’t people on this blog (quite rightly) criticise JWH for rushing into things like the intervention and the Murray Darling initiative?
I’d rather Kev took a little more time and made good decisions than go for an instant fix.
Anything symbolic in pro-chinese protesters outnumbering pro-Tibet protesters? I wonder if the intelligence services are filming the pro-China protests like they do to other protests?
BS Fairman @ 228 -
Anything symbolic in pro-chinese protesters outnumbering pro-Tibet protesters?
Other than there being far more Chinese than Tibetans living here, no. I find it interesting than most of the former expect the latter to live under the rule they themselves have ‘voted’ against with their feet.
The government could have ensured a peaceful relay by announcing than anyone arrested would be summarily deported to China on the next available plane. I suspect such an announcement would have had a greater impact on the Chinese than the Tibetans, and also the professional thugs that take advantage of protests to have ‘fun’
A ruling on the McEwen election must be imminent.
Phil Robins,
What do you mean by imminent (as in the next week? or next month?)
225 Kina – Come off it Kina Rudd has had a full 6 months to have changed the world. He’s done absolutely nothing. NOTHING! Now, if I can just remove my tongue from my cheek.
Sorry, make that 5 months, the lazy sod.
Crikey Whitey Says: @ 224,
Crikey, I think too many people miss the point of the summit.
To bring 1000 people together for 2 days of discussion of a range of ideas was never going to achieve any miraculous breakthroughs and couldn,t be expected to.
What it did do though, is, as you said in 224, is open up discussion on a broad range of issues throughout the wider community.
As these issues come to the fore for Government attention, they have at least been given a sense of priority and level of engagement at the community level will assist Ministers and Government Departments in formulating responses to these issues in a way that the community will find acceptable and be brought along with a sense of being able to further contribute to the process.
This way, the community has a sense of participation and ownership of the process. This is vitally important with Government having to address issues that have been made controversial by the previous mob for the benefit of vested interests. Check back through the main issues in the 2020 Report and they stand out as issues ignored or passed over by the previous Government.
They were either against the vested interests of LNP Corporate/Farming sector financial supporters or were just thrown into the “too hard” basket, left up to future technological solution etc.
The fact that a range of “mini 2020 summits” were instigated prior to and in conjunction with the main one in Canberra and that facilities are in place for the continued input of ideas and potential solutions of national problems & issues has tapped into the general communities willingness to think about problems and analysise issues and potential solutions.
This sort of community engagement has not happened for a very long time now and was actively discouraged by the previous Government which liked to exercise complete control of the flow of information and decisions which affected the community were controlled from the top down with any input being from vested interests and the general community was excluded.
In essence, the 2020 process was probably never expected to achieve any significant breakthrough, but will lead to better decision making with the community being better able to accept decisions taken in the national interest that would otherwise haver been unpalatable without opening them up for general discussion and input. This process I believe will continue with Rudd and will help to legitimise tough love type decisions.
Oops, sorry again. Make that 4 months, what with Christmas and Easter and the settling in period. I’ve lost total respect for Rudd now.
Right on Scorpio.
zoom Says: @ 227,
One of the biggest problems in this issue was caused by the way Governments rushed into it almost in a knee jerk fashion and provided enormous subsidies to encourage biofuel production.
In the US, grain prices have soared and there is now a shortage of feed grain for livestock and other areas are experiencing shortages of grain for food production. Export grains have dropped, hence the shortages being experienced in non grain producing countries as per my earlier post.
Us grain exports were previously subject to extensive Government “farm subsidies” and hence were generally cheaper by world market standards and tended to keep WM prices lower.
This whole issue of fuel shortages caused by slowing world oil production, peak oil , growing demand causing steep price rises and trying to counter this with increasing production of biofuels could potentially lead to catastrophe.
For every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction. See the introduction of “Workchoices” for a good example.
Swing Lowe (231), I thought a judicial decision of some sort was due late in April.
Phil, the High Court website has two judgments handed down today but neither are about McEwen.
http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/cases/cth/HCA/2008/
This is not looking good. Even the US is starting to wake up to the potential seriousness of the situation.
[
THE amount of two key greenhouse gases in Earth’s atmosphere rose sharply in 2007, and carbon dioxide levels this year are literally off the chart, the US government reported today.
In its annual index of greenhouse gas emissions, the US National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration found atmospheric carbon dioxide, the primary driver of global climate change, rose by 0.6 per cent, or 19 billion tonnes last year.
The amount of methane increased by 0.5 per cent, or 27 million tonnes, after nearly a decade of little or no change, according preliminary figures to scientists at the government’s Earth System Research Laboratory in Colorado.
Methane’s greenhouse effect is 25 times more potent than carbon dioxide’s, but there is far less of it in the atmosphere. [
http://www.news.com.au/story/0,23599,23590725-2,00.html
“I’m rich, I’m rich!”
Cool I Just saved my house from repossession.
Thanks for the tip Malcolm.
For years Howard made monumentally important decisions i.e Iraq ,GST without asking Australians what they think. During the election Kevin was accused of being Howard-lite, so to disprove the assertion, he’s done the complete opposite. At the summit he’s conferred with Australians about,… well he even let them pick the subject.
For the last five months he has been doing the opposite to Howard i.e. China speech, female G.G., sorry, 20/20.
If Howard was such a great P.M. how come doing the exact opposite is working out so well?
OK, off topic(s), but has anyone been following the progress of the Torch relay through The Australian?
It appears from the coverage that nothing much happened, to the obvious disappointment of the paper. Some guy sits on the road, another burns an imitation Chinese flag, and busloads of ethnic Chinese tourists visit. Apparently also, someone’s old mum is frightened by the idea of pro China supporters cheering the Torch.
Pretty tame and uninspiring from the perspective of the bloodbath they were agitating for and salivating at the prospect of.
And the Chinese security “Thugs” (now there’s a word with no pejorative connotations) merely walked passively along , but one of them by some mysterious convoluted interpretation of his actions created an International Incident by relighting an extinguished torch, which heinous and inappropriate act apparently required him to be led aside by an AFT officer.
While I have serious concerns myself about the Tibet situation, and human rights issues in China as well, I have nothing but contempt for the beatup on China being generated not out of any concern for Tibet or human rights, but in the hope that a serious incident might occur which would embarrass Rudd for the purpose of local political advantage only.
242 chilli_sauce – bloody good question. Glen and GG over to you.
Phil @238,
I read somewhere (sorry no link) that McEwen case comes back next week.
chilli_sauce # 242. Its called a honey moon. Wait until he has to make some real decisions.
Will Kevin freeze GST on petrol now that its tipped to reach $1.60/lt in May?
JOM,
The Budget will be the first test of the Government’s mettle and will really give the substance to the type of regime we are likely to see.
However, given Rudd’s deft touch to date, I see no reason why it won’t be as successful as everything else his Government has done to date.
The Libs and their supporters seem to love the concept of the “Rudd Honeymoon”. Probably because they are getting “F**ked over” on a regular basis.
The problem with the Govt’s take on petrol is that Oil companies will only top up their profits whatever the Govt cuts/holds.
246 John of Melbourne – sorry John I left you off the list. That honeymoon has lasted for months and months now. Even Mitchell on 3AW said today Rudd inherited this parlous economic situation from the previous government and most people I believe will see it that way. Don’t expect the so called honeymoon to be over soon. People have long memories.
Let’s face it John, Rudd is doing what the Howard government didn’t and people are responding accordingly.
‘The problem with the Govt’s take on petrol is that Oil companies will only top up their profits whatever the Govt cuts/holds’
So true Kina, same with housing, if the state govts cut land fees and taxes the developers and investors would just take a bigger share of the profits.
On McEwen I read somewhere that the parties lost the right to examine the 650 odd disputed ballot papers but were seeking other methods and ways.
Greeensborough Growler are you suggesting Rudd will remain as popular as he is now for some time yet?
We’ll see what the budget brings.
Gary Bruce, Neil Mitchell is like branch he bends with the wind. Parlous economic situation? What ever happened to running the economy is easy, the government hasn’t done anything it’s the mining boom?
John, Neil Mitchell is known as a conservative commentator and for good reason. Now John, which is it? Having listened to him putting Rudd down and calling him names he certainly isn’t a Rudd supporter. If he could somehow blame Rudd for the present situation he would.
Ok John which is it then? The previous government had no control over the economy and so can’t be blamed (as with this government then) or it did and is responsible for our present situation, which this government can’t be because it hasn’t made any decisions yet according to you?
JOM,
The Libs are hoping desperately that the Budget will be a catalyst for a decline in Rudd’s support. But what if it isn’t?
The punters tend to regard the Budget as ho hum. Remember last year when the Liberal Budget was lauded far and wide. Had absolutely no impact in that Government’s popularity.
I agree that the Budget is the next test. However, the Libs will descend into a despairing frazzle if Rudd’s popularity sails on regardless. The evidence to date says this might happen.
Won’t the budget include tax cuts? Gee, that should make them unpopular.
229 – I was suggesting that what happened in Canberra is a reflection of what is happening in Tibet. That is the Chinese overrunning the Tibetians.
The Libs are still waiting for the bounce that never came: the one from their last budget.
Gary Bruce IMHO he bends with the wind. All governments have an input into the economy. It has been 5 months since the previous government had lost office if the inflation genie is truely out of the bottle why wasn’t there a mini budget to address the issue? When can Rudd start taking responsibility?
Greeensborough Growler I agree, “The punters tend to regard the Budget as ho hum.” What goes up must ceom down.
If inflation continues to rise it will be a problem for Rudd after having identified with the cost of living inceases faced by “working families” in their eyes he has labelled himself as someone who will bring down cost of living expenses.
Nothing from the Federal Government on this dump day yet. I guess they don’t have too much bad news to hide at the moment. I have yet to check the state governments.
I always advise newly elected councillors to wait at least a year before they start pushing their own barrows – it takes time to understand how things work and the best ways to go about schieving outcomes.
State and Federal governments don’t have quite the same luxury of being able to sit back and learn – they do have to start making decisions from day one.
That said, however, being in government and not being in government are vastly different things and to assume from opposition that you have the answers right – or even the questions – is to assume far too much.
Thus, a wise government would act in the way Rudd is – get the symbols out of the way, consult (Howard not only didn’t consult but he regularly ignored expert advice and then had to back track when it turned out to be correct) and start a few debates going, get a feel for the whole thing, THEN start making changes.
More haste less speed.
One of the most ridiculous headlines ever “Masterclass” … pffttt
I remember last year how the Australian complained about middle class welfare and buying votes and thought it was a weakness of the Howard Gov. but when Costello’s budget came down it did exactly that. The Australian then praised the budget profusely.
Can’t follow them.
One thing I’m certain of, is that despite the largess of the election promises Labor were forced to make to keep up with the Coalition early in the election campaign, Kevin won’t be telling us about “non-core” promises.
That would make him Howard-lite.
246 JOM
If you think $1.60 for petrol is steep…
I think you’re going to run out of adjectives to match the prices we’re going to reach pretty quickly.
What’s the piece, in dollars and to the environment, of a litre of petrol, a litre of milk and a litre of coke?
Petrol is still ridiculously cheap, and anyone complaining about it’s price hasn’t looked too far down the road IMO.
257 JOM
Bring DOWN the cost of living expenses…pfffft!! The link to the fact that Kevin targeted this demographic in the election is more than a little tenuous.
I think you’ll find on closer examination that this ‘demographic’ voted for Kevin because they found that he was at least making the impression that he was listening to them = something the other side had failed to do for quite some time.
Kevin promised to do everything he could, but given the economic circumstances he’s been elected in to, I’d like to hear YOUR idea on how this might be achieved, and therefore how Kevin isn’t meeting those ideas.
Re the torch relay
went back to the dolt blog where he said rudd ’spun’ that the “blue men” would not be used for security and Kevin Gospar (or whatever) stated the fact that the blue men WOULD supply the security and found his words heavily modified!
I left a few comments which won’t get published but do show him HIS, DOLT’S, spinning was noticed!
None of my comments to Pies’ blog of some hours ago have been published even though unlike an earlier post here no four letter words were used (sorry about that one William.) Pies really should not try to comment on economics, safer to stick to the Heiner myth
263
onimod
I think it is high time oil prices were given in euros (the currency not the grey plains kangaroo!) instead of the fast-depreciating US dollar
Pies: “How do I hate thee, Labor. Let me count the ways.”
257 John of Melbourne – Ever heard of the Reserve Bank. Ever heard of interest rates going up to stem inflation which, by the way, started under the previous government. So John what should the government do? So the government is elected in November. Then there is Christmas. When would you suggest the mini budget could have taken place, given that the budget is given in May?
As for taking responsibility your side has yet to admit taking any responsibility at all. Surely not even you can believe Labor has caused the rise in inflation in four months given that we are still working on the Liberal’s budget.
It doesn’t really matter what currency oil is sold in. Euros is not going to make a difference to price that Australians pay for petrol.
John at 257, if you’ve been following what various economists as well as the RBA and the banks have been saying, firstly, there have been warning signals in relation to inflation emerging well before the LNP lost the last election, largely ignored by the LNP because of Howard’s stranglehold on how that gov’t ran, including their contribution to how the economy runs. Witness the warnings from the RBA, witness Costello’s frustration with Howard’s profligacy. This a clear contribution to inflation. Contributing to an even murkier economic picture is the sub prime effect on the U.S. economy and other economies and banks with major knock on effects, such as the Bank of Scotland, etc. Any one who has been following this with any degree of impartiality, understands that some of what the Rudd gov’t has to deal with is well beyond any gov’t’s control in relation to the economy, and some of it, Howard’s profligacy, for instance, is, and if Mitchell acknowledges this, I’d advise you have a bit of a think about this, because he is an influential conservative talk back jock.
Very difficult economic situation to manage, John, got some strengths, got some nightmares. Not black or white for any Fed. gov’t.
Who was that chiselled man on the 7.30 Report tonight? Just got home and missed who he was – haven’t seen him before.
Well put Harry. I think John also mixes up “responsibility” with “taking action”. The government is taking action (through the budget process) but has not been responsible for where we are now economically. Not yet.
Crikey:
Cardinal George Pell, Roman Catholic Archbishop of Sydney, held a “thank you” dinner for former Prime Minister John Howard at his official residence at Cathedral House last night.
…yeah, thanks for being such a little ugly rodent that Australia is now free of!
271 I think John has been reading too much Piers.
http://www.news.com.au/story/0,23599,23590216-5007146,00.html
Gary at 271, It seems to me that there has been a fairly stupid narrative run in the MSM, about the economy. And why would anyone be surprised, really. Whether the gov’t can translate their message about screwing things down to control inflation, or not, we’ve as yet to see.
Returning to the topic, Scorpio.
More horrific information. Lateline.
The dreadful condition of the River Murray, as it concerns South Australia.
Apparently the drying has left our water supplies open to self poisoning, as we drink the various metals released by the dry. And even worse, should the outside chance of rain water occur, these metals will be released, again into our water.
May be wise to stay where you are.
Does not change my mind, needless to say, that climate change and water are the most pressing, indeed imperative, of the issues with which the Government must deal. And pronto.
Yeah, Crikey, I saw that.
Pretty scary stuff. I think that they may be a tad optimistic in believing that they can neutralise that acidity with lime.
There may be a totally intractable problem there which may never be resolved unless mother nature does a reversal and returns the seasons back to what they were down there 40 or 50 years ago.
Kirribilli Removals 272
Unfortunately, free of Howard, we are not free of Pell. Loved the man, did he not? When it mattered. All gracious and so, to FPMJH (apparently not to be Sir, so I am told). But, all over. Preparing the ground, for himself.
Pell is interested in Pellevation. Watch him.
Free now,to welcome Kev. And as we will see, the Pope, no less. Pell will want arm in arm coverage.
I cannot believe such a self serving Archbishop. Never miss an opportunity.
CW275 Scorpio 276
Would the fact that the previous Fed Gov did nothing for 11 years re take over of the Murray -Darling System have contributed to the problem that is there now? And of course what about previous Gov’s before that?
Doug.
A, even more for sure. B, definitely for sure.
Impossible not to see, as I said, on and on to the despair of the water waster, for all my adult life really, ‘driest state, driest continent’.
How much more important for the negligent Governments, that is sssss, to have seen, ‘It’s the Water, Stupid.’
Thanks Crikey
As a Queenslander I have not been up with the M-D as I should have. But if there has been wastage by farms upstream through the outmoded irrigation systems, and the sowing of crops which use heaps of water like rice and cotton then then there is less for Adelaide dounstream. All these have been under control of Gov’s at some period or other and ultimately still are. I suppose the main question is what to do about it now. The short term seems to have everyone stumped but the long term is more optimistic now it is under Fed control(the political persuasion not as important as the fact it is under control of 1 authority rather than a number of self interested states).
And so no water, therefore less food, and of course the cost of shelter(homes) is thru the roof. The three basic requirements.
I think we have been living on credit for a long while in regard to basic requirements and it is fast approaching pay back time. Wealth is useless without these.
‘free of Howard, we are not free of Pell’
Pell owed Howard an enormous debt, In the USA the church has had to pay out over US$2 billion in damages, in Australia that was avoided, no nasty inquiries.
‘And as we will see, the Pope, no less. Pell will want arm in arm coverage.’
Will be interesting to see, the pope met with victims in the USA, he has probably gained extra respect for this action, I think it was a good thing to do.
CW 277, Rod 281
I dare not express my true feelings about that “thing” Geo Pell. He and JWH deserve each other!
Good Morning PBs.
I have just returned from the Anzac Day Dawn Service held at Simpson barracks here in Melbourne. Crowd numbers were up and approximately 3000 people attended.
As always, people were in reverential mode as they remembered past loved ones and friends lost in some battle or other over the last ninety three years. Australians, as a rule, tend to be fairly chirpy when out and about. However, the subdued tone and total silence during the service proved once again that we know how to pay homage to our fallen heroes.
No doubt many have strong views on our participation in various conflicts as a nation. However, we must always remember the brave service men and women who have done their duty to the best of their ability. The bounty of propserity and freedom we all enjoy today has come about because of their great sacrifices.
Lest We Forget.
Hear, hear GG.
I was pleased to see that the 39th “Choco” battalion from the Kokoda track is leading the march in Melbourne this morning.
At last, full recognition for those reluctant, unfit, under-trained amateur soldiers who did the professionals’ job as well as anyone could have, for 10 long weeks.
And thank God for our greatest PM, John Curtin, who stood up to Rooseveld AND Churchill and got our ME troops back home. These started reaching the Kokoda Track in time to start pushing the Japs back.
I Howard had been PM then he would have caved in, allowed the convoy to be redirected to Rangoon and the division, without its transport and heavy equipment would have been effortlessly captured by the Japs–and Kokoda might have ended differently!
Bloody Howard was such a gutless Bush sycophant, such a arsekisser, that he didn’t pull the troops out of Iraq that first Christmass which had been his plan.
Curtin, in the middle of directing the struggle in WW2, also got through fundamental economic reforms that are still in place today. He foresaw the demobilisation after WW2 and how Australia had to be more populated and did the groundwork of planning for the postwar immigration. What Chifley achieved in his term was mostly carry out the vision of Curtin. Then Menzies coasted along on those reforms for pretty much his whole too-long term and when he did interfere caused 20% inflation and had to put a credit squeeze on.
Not to my surprise, none of my comments to Pies’ or dolt’s blog have yet been published.
Of course, according to Alexander Downer, everything Curtin did both before and during the War was a cowardly publicity stunt because Labor was and always has been gutless in Foreign Relations.
Dowver’s infamous Earl Page speech here: http://www.foreignminister.gov.au/speeches/2005/050517_earle_page_college.html
Rudd’s brilliant reply: http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,15332416-7583,00.html
Incidentally, reading the above article was the first time I realised Rudd had the fire in the belly required to be Australian PM.
A great read.
Fuel:
http://www.nationalpost.com/news/story.html?id=469426
“Jeffrey Rubin, chief economist and strategist with Canadian Imperial Bank of Commerce, forecasts in a new report titled The Age of Scarcity that Canadians and Americans should brace for $2.25-a-litre gasoline, or about $7 a gallon, by 2012. That’s nearly double the current nationwide average price for regular unleaded gas of $1.23. The price will top a record $1.40 this summer as it starts its climb, Mr. Rubin said.”
2012 isn’t as far away as some people act…
“People will move closer to where they work.”
If someone could explain how this might happen in Australia without massive massive cultural change I’d be obliged? With a bit of luck the farmers will get some of their land back in the next 20 years I reckon.
“History will record Downer as Australia’s longest serving but least significant foreign minister.”
Absolutely!
286
Thanks BB.
seems like he’s keeping plenty in reserve
Public transport will HAVE to become more important.
One way would be on main roads leading in/out of CBDs have a bus-only lane then ru frequent trolleybuses.
trolleybus?
Look here;
http://www.tbus.org.uk/article.htm
http://www.trolleybus.net/
The hybrid version of trolleybuses can run without even overhead powerlines which is the only infrastructure needed, so way cheaper than electric tram and train!
Secondly, they are very comfortable, with an incredibly smooth ride. I remember riding the Trolley buses down Port Rd to the QEH in the 60s. Their 100% flat floor makes them easy for mothers with prams or shopping trolleys etc.
In the newer outer suburbs trolley buses could collect passengers and run them to nearest railway station or shopping centre etc.
Still using fossil fuel but at a very high efficiency! And a trolley bus stuck at a red light or traffic jam would use hardly any power! Unlike the cars inching along in front of my Duthy St shop in the morning, belching out pollution and global warming gases!
Hehehe I love Pies calling for a minibudget.
Sure thing Pies, will only take me 5 minutes to work out a half trillion dollar mini budget. I mean, geez, does Pies ever engage brain b4 putting pen to paper?
290
what brain?
It was dissolved by mysterious white powder wasn’t it?
Tell you what though, some sizzling intellect in either SA or Natl Transport Dept has worked out a scheme to make it harder to use minor roads (like Duthy/George St in Unley, SA) so forcing traffic onto major roads.
Of course, no work is done to make Fullarton/Unley/King William/Goodwood Rds wider, thus ensuring smooth, fuel-efficient traffic flows! No public transport improvements either!
I have taken advantage of Duthy St being a carpark 7-9.00am weekdays by making up a heap of posters and sticking them in my window
BB 286 and Thomarse 288
“…like most small men in search of a big idea…”
I liked Rudd’s very apt Downer put down. It would not surprise me if Dolly becomes obsessed with creating a myth that he was a great statesman. Lots of spare time and lots of long lunches tends to do that.
So what can be said about his indelible mark on Australian and world history?
It reminds me of Gough Whitlam’s party trick at the time of Chamberlain’s appeasement with Hitler in Munich. He used to hold aloft a roll of toilet paper while quoting Chamberlain’s words thus: “Peace in our time. It bears his mark and mine.”
A small man in search of a big idea indeed! I guess you call it hubris.
http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,15332416-7583,00.html
What I don’t understand is how Menzies could stay in London for six months expecting to become UK Prime Minister??? i mean, not even a member of the House of Commons? And what was he going to do if he was put in charge???
Curtin was dead right not to enter a national government!
And the way Menzies worded his declaration of war on Germany “The UK has declared war on Germany and consequently Australia declares war on Germany” arse kissing even there! He could have listed Hitler’s crimes as reason for declaring war!
Maybe it’s the reverence of ANZAC Day but watching Rudd yesterday at the HMAS Sydney service and again this morning in Canberra he seems to have an aura of peace, love and tranquillity about him. It’s so nice not to have Howard’s small mindedness and nastiness and bigotry anymore.
It is also nice to have some decent human beings in goverment again. I was impressed by Joel Fitzgibbon’s speech at Gallipoli, down to earth, fair dinkum and no BS. But the surprise for me is Veterans’ Affairs Minister Alan Griffin who spoke at Villers-Bretonneux. I hadn’t really heard much of him until now but his speech was brilliant and moving and he finished up by speaking fluent French thanking the people of Villers-Bretonneux for keeping their promise of 90 years ago to look after the fallen Aussies buried there. Downer could only wish his French was a fraction as good.
This is why I like and really respect Kevin Rudd http://news.ninemsn.com.au/article.aspx?id=262976
It is great to see ANZAC day not being used for political ends as Howard was ever keen to do.
When you live in a country like China (as I presently am) and reflect on ANZAC day you realise those that sacrificed their lives, their youth and their health defending Australia are true heros in every word. May their spirit never die and may we never forget we owe our very precious Aussie way of life and democracy to our brave diggers. Today I am very proud to be an Aussie.
Lest we forget
Mick, ex RAAF, Dongguan, China.
BB
You missed this pearler from Downers speech.
‘In the Vietnam era, the war was lost – not on the battlefields but in the media and in the university campuses.’
Reminiscent of Adolphs speech re WW1, we didn’t lose the war in the trenches, we were stabbed in the back by the J’s at home.
Vera #297
It is indeed very appropriate that there was a dawn service in France to remember a previous generation of Australians who fought so bravely and effectively on the Western Front during the Great War, but I regret to observe that your partisan political perspective on today’s Anzac Day commemorations (whether or not ‘decent’ people agree with that perspective) was a very ’small minded’ contribution.
300 david – I too thought each minister performed very well indeed and were a credit to Australia. That’s exactly what was going through my mind as I watched and listened to them. Does that make my contribution ’small minded’? I think not.
Vera #297,
Loved your comments and agree with you wholeheartedly.
The NAB today increased its variable interest rate by 0.1%.
I’m not an economist or accountant and am pretty ordinary in all things mathmatical. There is something I don’t understand, and maybe someone on this blog can give me a simple (very)explanation.
The Reserve Bank sets the interest rate and we are told it is increased to lower demand for money, therefore reducing funds available to the public and business and thereby lowering inflation. I understand the logic.
But if interest rates are so increased, we pay more for money borrowed in real dollars. Who gets to keep those extra real dollars we pay? If the lenders (banks) do, presumably the money they have lent is theirs, or they in turn have contracted to borrow it at fixed rates. Presumably they are not the idiots I and I suspect others are. Thus they receive a gratuitous increase in income.
The banks would say they need the extra income to cover their sub prime losses (whatever that means) but that is not the reason the Reserve increased interest rates.
Then the banks set additional margins, as the NAB has just done, usually claiming it is to offset sub prime losses.
Am I missing something?
GB (301) I respect your opinion on how you say each minister performed so no I do not regard Post #301 as ’small minded’. Please go back to Posts # 297 & #300, read them carefully and then you might understand the point I was making. I credit you as an intelligent person.
David Charles #300
Name me one decent Howard minister. One that knew nothing of the lies about Tampa, the children overboard, WMD, the hurt Workchoices was causing etc, There are many more examples, playing the race card be it Aboriginals, refugees or Muslems before each election to divide this country, my country, for whom I and my father and my father’s father served wearing Australia’s military uniforms with pride.
My grandfather was one of those who fought in the Great War and he remains there under the ground. Dad was a Rat of Tobruck and I am proud of the years I spent in the RAN.
So don’t you dare call my opinions “small minded” 100000+ brave Aussies have died so I may have freedom of speech to voice my opinions be they small or otherwise. That’s called democracy.
Howard the dictator is no more
Lest we forget
Good for you Vera, the ANZAC ledgend will no longer be tainted or manipulated by Howard and his goons for their discusting political means. Many great Aussies fought and died so we can enjoy our freedoms, freedoms that most countries don’t have. Howard has gone and now we can rebuild our country into something we can be proud of once more.
Lest we forget.
Sinowestie
Cheers, I was one pissed off Pusser (navy talk for sailor) there for a while but I’ve calmed down now.
Sniping, condecending hypocritical remarks like those at #300 make my blood boil!
Scorpio, you may be interested that I can report even greater numbers attending the Brighton Jetty Dawn Service.
I have not read any of the the thread, as yet.
I am truly perplexed. I like to attend. To pay homage and my respects. But. It is so difficult.
I went, before it was an event, because I meant it. The numbers were few, once upon a time. That was sad, but it seemed more sincere, somehow. It is intriguing that so many turn up, but for what, exactly?
Songs were sung, but few knew the words.
I have, I must say, been an unhappy attendee, in the last decade, Feeling myself to be an unwilling statistic to be used in the history wars.
I am not comfortable, still.
#299 Rod says:
“You missed this pearler from Downers speech.
‘In the Vietnam era, the war was lost – not on the battlefields but in the media and in the university campuses.’”
Downer is a soft cock!
It’s so nice not to have Howard’s small mindedness and nastiness and bigotry anymore.
Or his terminal unease with both himself and other people, especially his laugh, it was just a bit too forced and unnatural.
Vera, in your experience, what was the general view in the Navy towards Howard et al?
Fulvio
The way I understand it on interest rates is that when the reserve bank increases interest rates it increases the rate banks borrow at. Thus the banks do not benefit from any increase in interest rates, the margin between the rate at which they borrow and which they lend should remain the same regardless of any increase or decrease in rates.
However, the sub prime debacle has seen the availabilty of cash decreased world wide, which means that there is now a premium on borrowed money which the banks are passing on.
There is one part I don’t understand but, and that is our interest rates are 2-3% above most of the OECD, therefore we should be attracting a lot of extra investment income which should make our money supply easier for the banks and these extra increases like the NAB’s unneccessary.
Why does not the Future Fund lend the banks a billion or three each?
‘Future’ Fund (really a PS/military superannuation fund, but FF appeals to people who think it is for the ‘future’ of all) would make good interest and banks would not have to raise interest rates above the RBA mandated increases. this way we would have a real Future Fund’
FF could also take up an issue of shares from the banks, acquiring these at a good price.
310 Just me
And we no longer have to listen to that dull dead voice! Yay!
The right whingers though have noticed a fatal flaw in Rudd’s public speaking–he licks his lips. This becomes ‘lizard-like lip licking.’ on Pies’ and Dolt’s blogs. After reading this I took note and yup, every so often out shoots his tongue and licks his lips. That should disappear as Rudd settles further into the PM role. I have a feeling he has some shyness? Hence the rapid delivery & ll?
Fulvio & Rod,
It’s also another nail in the coffin of “Howard being an economic genious”. The interest charged by the Banks in being the lowest in over 30 years is not because of the Government but because Banks were able to borrow, over seas, at a much lower rate than the Reserve Bank’s rates (sub prime). Which means that the interest rates on loans were %1 to %1.5 lower then they would have been normally, before deregulation of the Financial Institutions, by Keating.
The lower interest rates were Globally lower, not because of the Howard (genious??)
Thanks for that Rod.
Crikey, that is a lovely War Memorial at Brighton though. I have some great pictures of my children standing near it.
I also enjoyed visiting the museam at the old Town Hall. It features HMAS Glenelg I think. A Corvette. My dad served on Corvettes during WW11.
They were tough cookies, those who served on them. They also needed a strong stomach because they were quite fast but very narrow and rolled around quite a bit.
My Grandfather served at the Western Front, winning a DCM at a place called “Pollygon Wood”. I looked up that battle. It was horrific.
He was a stretcher bearer. At one stage, he was the only bearer left alive & being a large, very strong man, he was carrying out wounded from “no-man’s land” on his back.
His Medical Records go into more than three pages. He caught everything imaginable & suffered terribly from “trench foot” as well as having been gassed.
He deserved a medal just for the personal suffering alone but the Citation for his Award makes my head spin. Officers were given VC’s for far less. He was just a Corporal.
I have been able to download all his Military Records as well as my fathers from the intertubes. These are the types of thoughts you should keep in mind when you attend a service like that.
Many of our relations served in all theatres of war, some not coming back and it is good th think about them and remember their sacrifice.
Shaun Carney in the Age today makes the point the any opposition leader would struggle at the moment. He then talks about Nelson’s single digit approval- its not approval its PPM, why cant commentators get it right?? He then makes the stupid point the the 2PP is where it is expected post-election- I think a 8% swing is NOT whay would be expected
http://www.theage.com.au/news/opinion/shaun-carney/2008/04/25/1208743241801.html
304 david charles – David I understand what you are getting at but why should ANZAC Day be exempted from the very right the diggers fought for ie freedom of speech – the freedom to express a partisan point of view if one desires without being criticised for doing so. Sure criticise the sentiment if you disagree with it but don’t try and stifle someone for expressing it on the very day we commemorate those who preserved that right for us.
Gary Bruce #318
I am not going to stifle any opinions expressed that I disagree with. Anyway I notice Vera has exercised an overegged right of reply and others on the thread have supported her. I sincerely (and without wanting to ’snipe’) believed my point had merit. I am pleased that ministers in the Federal government including the Prime Minister are talking so positively about the feats of Australian troops on the Western Front in resisting Ludendorf’s Spring offensive during 1918. I don’t want to get into a slanging match with anyone about whether or not persons in past governments were ‘decent’ or not and certainly not in the context of a discussion about Anzac Day celebrations. I suppose if that makes me appear less ‘decent’ than those who think they know better than me then I will live with that. Thank you for the courtesy of your response.
Just me #310
It’s a while since I was in the navy but hubby is still active in Reserves and he’s a Labour man. I was a lot younger then and my fellow sailors and I were more interested in footy, cricket, getting on the grog having a good time with mates when we were off duty. I don’t recall anyone talking politics much in fact a lot probably wouldn’t have bothered voting if they didn’t have to. We were young and carefree then. We swore allegiance to Queen and country and that was the extent of politics for some.
The story goes that the military vote consevative but I notice in Afganastan when Kev dropped in there were a couple of diggers with Kevin 07 T shirts and they all seemed pleased to see him (as they used to be when Howard visited though i must admit.)
During the election campaigne Labour promised free heath care for immediate family members of the armed services personnel. That would be popular I should imagine.
Vera @305,
There were plenty of decent people in the Howard Govt in my view. And, I might add, the present Govt hasn’t been in power long enough to allow any informed view as to whether they are “decent” or not.
Moreover, if me saying this antagonises you, that’s just tough!
You are such a sadsack David Charles.
Lighten up a bit. Howard and Downer claimed the high ground on National Security could only be held by the Liberals (or the UAP before them). In order to press home this contention Downer, in collusion with a couple of “right thinking” academics back in 2005 created the myth of the “cowardly, appeasing Labor Party”. He even tried to peg Curtin as an appeaser… of Mussolini!… years before he became PM.
The Libs hijacked Gallipoli and eschewed anything more than a mention of Kokoda… why?
Because Kokoda was a Labor show and went right in the face of “Empire” politics of the time and the Americocentric politics of today (and let’s not forget Labor forged the American Alliance, Menzies merely cut the ribbon). The North African campaign was seen as our duty to participate in, and the withdrawl of the troops from there to the Pacific was characterized as Curtin’s lack of ticker in standing up to worldwide Fascism.
All Curtin wanted to do was to save Australia from possible Japanese invasion, a mere bagatelle (in Downer’s mind) to our duties as a Dominion.
All kinds of revisionist claptrap has been dredged up to corroborate this Tory fantasy.
One I remember well is the modern theseis – based on papers discovered in Japan after the war – that the Japanese would never have invaded Australia, and never wanted to, hence our involvement in the Pacific was not much more than a political stunt by Labor, etc. etc.
Firstly, we didn’t know what the Japanese were up to in 1942, and we certainly didn’t know what lay in the Imperial archives in Tokyo, waiting to be discovered after 1945. A decision had to be made, and made it was.
Secondly, it’s a pretty good bet that documents or no documents, if we’d left New Guinea undefended those Japanese veterans streaming down from Buna and Gona towards Moresby wouldn’t have said “No” to the chance of occupying a major port on the southern side of the island unopposed.
The spectacle of this kind of myth-making by the conservatives, Howard’s manic dashes from Sydney to Frementle just so he could wave goodbye to the troops a second time, and Downer’s looseness with the truth and common sense of history all lead to one conclusion: that if anyone tried to kidnap Anzac Day, it was the Tories, not Labor.
312 – Can you remember when One Nation came out with the policy of printing more money to pay for spending? Your suggestion is heading down that path (although nowhere near as bad). The future fund lending a couple of billion to each of banks is unlikely to have any large scale effect on the interest rate. The loan books of the big four are all in the hundreds of billions, so a cheaper billion or three is only going to cut a base point of the rate they charge customers (that is 0.01%), if at all.
317 Andrew
Carney makes the valid point that the Liberals have to grow up.
Carney claims poll figures are normal for post election period but in fact the figures are way higher than normal. To my knowledge getting results consistently averaging in the low 60’s is unheard of.
He also says the polls are not any different to 12 months ago when under Howard so why panic and blame Nelson when his approval rating is at a credible 38%? Even though his PPM is in single digits.
Some people apparently had not been able to “bear” to ditch Howard at the ballot box and so the margin then narrowed. But last year Howard had the advantage of incumbency and used it to the full in the last week of the election frightening some of the more nervous people with the “horrible” prospect of a change in Gov. to Labor. Now Rudd has incumbency and near an election, all things being equal and the Labor Party still performing well, the margin should not narrow as much. In addition Rudd is consolidating many of the additional votes, whereas last election some votes proved soft. Even though the figures are roughly the same as 12 months ago the Liberal Party is in a signicantly worse position now.
Just because we have always had a 2 party system it does not mean this will continue. Until the Libs get rid of their extreme right wing they will always be in trouble. I will not shed any tears if “RIP” Libs in their present form. I think that Democracy being what it is another party would form and become the Opposition to represent those people who the Gov policies do not reprent sufficiently and it could even be to the Left and not the Right, especially as people become more aware of global warming. There is nothing “sacred” about either party and power does in reality reside with the voters. Politicians should never forget this power balance.
323 I was not advocating printing money!
I know it would be but a small amount by comparison to the loan book but we are only talking about the amounts currently being rolled-over and here maybe a smaller amount might play a big pump-priming sort of role.
322 BB
Good post.
It is not much commented on that the attacks that finally started the Germans pulling back were made by Australian soldiers–under Australian (not British) leadership. The same with Viller–Bretonneux, Australian soldiers under Australian leadership. That is why that deserves more recognition.
Sometimes I think too much is made of the superiority of Australian officers. Certainally at the time of WW1, and up until the 1950’s as I recall, we considered ourselves British. At the time of WW1 all senior officers were trained in Britain.
No doubt that we have had some magnificant military leaders, but we have had our share of duds too. For example, I have done a little research on POW’s and the Burma Railway. The death rate amongst OR’s was much higher than officers because most officers used their rank to avoid the heavy work. The problem stemmed from the class system that influenced how people who were to become officers were chosen.
GA @ 327,
General Sir John Monash, Australia’s foremost military leader of WW1, wasn’t trained in Britain.
And I don’t think there is much evidence that the class system influenced how Australian officers were chosen (though no doubt class was crucial in the choice of British officers).
Thomarse # 326
I agree with what you said about the importance of the actions of Australian troops at Viller-Bretonneux in April 1918. Sir John Monash was a great Australian and is widely considered one of the more astute military commanders to emerge from the slaughter of WW1. Not sure BB’s post at #322 had anything to say about that.
The young John Monash reputedly once earned a shilling for holding Ned Kelly’s horse while Ned was busy plying his ‘trade’ which would not have endeared him to the upper classes had they known.
319 david charles – “I don’t want to get into a slanging match with anyone about whether or not persons in past governments were ‘decent’ or not and certainly not in the context of a discussion about Anzac Day celebrations.”
David your view is as valid as anyone else’s view here and that doesn’t make you any less “decent”.
I will make one last comment on this and leave it at that. When you first replied to Vera’s posting surely that was entering into an argument on her comments and “in the context of a discussion about Anzac Day celebrations.” You exercised your right of free speech and good on you just as Vera did.
322
Bushfire Bill
Not only did Curtin have to think about a possible invasion of Australia if the Kokoda campaign was lost, he was also very concerned about Australia being isolated and cut-off from Europe/UK/US if Japs were able to consolidate their Pacific gains. That is what led him to put Australian forces under the command of McArthur.
That last fear was maybe unrealistic given the yank’s fury at Pearl Harbor but that may have been harder to gauge from Canberra in the age before the internet, 24 hour TV etc etc.
See there’s been another outpouring of love between the Libs and Nats
http://www.abc.net.au/news/video/2008/04/22/2224299.htm
LOL!
Thomarse?
The Kokoda campaign “lost”?
What Downer was advocating was that Curtin should not have brought the troops home at all (as did Menzies, Page and the rest of the UAP bludgers on Churchull’s Imperial War Cabinet).
If that had been the case then Kokoda wouldn’t have been lost. It wouldn’t have been fourht at all.
We would have been faced with a solid Japanese occupation of New Guinea, access to Australian waters and northern ports, a strangulation of Pacific shipping routes based on those ports and quite likely a much longer war… at least from the perspective of what we knew at the time.
Curtin’s repatriation of the North African troops was quite possibly of world strategic importance.
320
Vera
Thats a ditto for me as well, though there was nothing like a good game of Two-Up out the back of the Huskison R.S.L when based at JB.
I think that is where Bleak ran into Brenden during his introduction to Two-Up.
http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/opinion/cartoons/
334 BB
Exactly! The Sunday Soldiers had performed brilliantly even tho underequipped, not even a Vickers heavy machine gun in reply to the Japs mountain gun, but they were at their last gasp, had stopped the Japs but that was it. The regulars took it from there.
That getting the convoy back to Australia. . .Churchill and Rooseveld, Menzies, Page, Bruce and that crud all against it, but Curtin stuck to his guns and by crikey just as bloody well!
Australia owes so much to John Curtin! As to Lord Lunchalot’s revisionism, well. . .
329
david charles
One thing that makes the speeches by Rudd, Fitzgibbon & Alan Griffin decent
they just talked about the battles being commemorated
not try to relate these to Iraq/Afganistan
Also, very simple language. As someone else remarked, no BS.
Decent.
That attempt by Downer to re-write history to debase Labor’s, and particularly Curtin’s role in standing up to Churchill, and bringing the M.E. troops back to defend Australia, made my blood boil. I, too, thought Rudd’s response was something you could be pleased that this particular nerd knew enough about it to be able to take it up to the man responsible for either not knowing about or not sufficiently forensically taking apart the $300 mill bribe to Saddam Hussein. You can’t have it both ways on this.
I’m to be convinced that anyone other than Petro Georgio and perhaps Judy Moylan were ‘decent’ in the former gov’t, in any sense I’d understand it. Win at all costs, and the devil take the hindmost, is the LNP, which it continues to do.
313
Thomarse Says:
The right whingers though have noticed a fatal flaw in Rudd’s public speaking–he licks his lips. This becomes ‘lizard-like lip licking.’ on Pies’ and Dolt’s blogs.
Howard is a lip-licker.
People Skills just blamed Swan for ‘talking up inflation.’
I mean, geez, give me a break, inflation over 4%, higher for a lot of food items, but it is all Swan’s fault for ‘talking up inflation’?
Nothing about privatisation and govt spending gone mad since 2001?
You expect this crap from Pies, from a senior Lib you do expect something better!
Cut yourselves loose from Howard/Costello! Acknowledge the gross economic irresponsibility for the last 8 years! And move on!
Nope, stick to the past say the Libs!
Hmmm is the day of 2 party democracy past? Does require 2 functoning parties!
340 Thomarse – I saw that too. I couldn’t believe what I was hearing. He’s treating us all like imbeciles.
Maybe it is him is the imbecile?
10 interest rate rises on the trot but inflation what inflation???
Thomarse #337
Thanks for sharing your thoughts. But how does that relate to my Post 329 which agreed with one of your earlier posts about Viller-Bretonneux?
340 and following
http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2008/04/26/2228177.htm?section=justin
This is coming from a guy who can’t balance the budget on his measly $120K income and expenditure.
It’s probably a bit much for him to understand basic economics.
I like the way he’s calling for something to be done; he seems full of suggestions.
Thomarse – there’s no ‘maybe’ as far as I’m concerned. Another name goes in the ‘too simple to be trusted with the country’ basket.
It is better to keep one’s mouth shut and be thought a fool than to open it and resolve all doubt. ~Abraham Lincoln
HSO @ 338,
I’m yet to be convinced that either mainstream party is morally superior to the other (or more “decent”, for that matter).
Although it seems to be an article of faith for some people around here that Labor is morally superior to the conservatives, I assume these are people who have not heard of the current NSW government.
Lord Lunchalot is to ‘lead’ a group walking the path of the Sandakan Death March later this year. Maybe he’ll learn something along the way, though I doubt it.
It’s hard to credit that this dolt is the son of a Changi survivor
People Skills, would have to be one of the one of the most useless pieces of so called alternative gov’t I’ve ever seen, and the ABC just as useless a piece of analytical source of news. Antonio, if you’re out there, this is just another crock of rubbish.
“People Skills just blamed Swan for ‘talking up inflation.’”
Well that may just reveal their economic credentials – if you talk about it will happen. Nothing to do with prices and demand and supply.
Dyno, I would be the first to agree that NSW Labor is totally moribund, politically and ethically. I was speaking about the Federal sphere.
HSO, fair enough.
Even in the Federal sphere, though, give Labor 11.5 years in power and I’m sure they’ll tot up plenty of scandals.
Economics by fiat. If Abbott can do that make him PM.
Let there be….” “
343
david charles
I guess that BB showed that there has been a lot of selective choosing of battles to commemorate. Also, as I stated earlier, very simple, BS-free speeches at Anzac Cove and in France, no rah rah using them to recruit support for some present day war
350
Dyno
So you are saying Howard was in power for way too long?
Agree with that one!
Thomarse,
You’re entitled to your opinion about Howard. The Australian electorate opined on him as leader 6 times (first in 1987), and I guess his 4-2 win/loss record speaks for itself. Far from perfect, but not bad.
I just find it remarkable that so many on this blog tend to assume that anyone who disagrees with their politics is less “decent” (their word) than they are.
Downer will be remember for ‘things that batter’, fish-net stockings, not reading the emails on his desk about AWB bribery, being a bumbling fool type and, being possessed by envy and jealousy over Rudd.
As a foreign minister he did nothing because there was nothing to do – his policy was to wait for instructions from Bush and Cheney.
Oh yeh and in the political history books Downer will be remembered as one of the cowards that helped destroy the Liberal party by lacking the guts and responsibility to tell Howard to go.
Oh how Alexander must seethe with hatred for Rudd – to be shown up and so outclassed by his Diplomatic competitor and, then his Foreign Affairs competitor and also at being Opposition leader. Downer failed at all those positions – Rudd aced them with ease.
It is too pathetic, really, to arrive home night after night. And find myself sweeping leaves, over and over, they never stop, despite my endeavours and then I thought I must chuck all these papers into the recycle bin, and gee, it is already full and includes electioneering material and as much as I wish to keep Kev and Nicole, I was ruthless then I went outside on to the footpath and clipped the growling grass and swept it away from the drains, the grass I must say seems to be enjoying the dribble of rain we have managed to accomplish and somehow amongst all this I managed to tidy my kitchen not that I have tidied the rest of the house and I have completed the BAS stuff even though the spreadsheet formulae somehow went crazy and made life hell, little wonder I can hardly spare the time to blog, and my footy tips are not going at all well, though I did get the Crows. And another or so, but not the disgraceful Essendon. Anyway, all is not lost, I am lunching at the Bridgewater Mill, and I do hope that Alexander Downer will not be there, unlikely given that he cannot charge it to the taxpayer, and Le will be ever so pleased, and while I was clipping the damn grass in the middle of the night with my torch in hand I noticed as I swept, that fissures have developed in the footpath and road of my crazily watering neighbour. So, if you never hear from me again, you will know I have been swallowed into the earth. But at least I will have a last and decent supper.
HOWARD’S LEGACY
I received the yesterday as a “personal message” (PM) from another member of an applied optical engineering forum I contribute to.
At first I was going to bin it, but later on I mellowed and decided to reply.
I gently pointed out to the guy that Howard lost both the election and his seat in November 2007.
I told him that Howard probably didn’t use the words attributed to him. To have done so would have been political suicide. I suggested that perhaps he (and some members of his government) may have privately held these opinions, but they would never have uttered them out loud.
But, upon reflection, I wondered to myself whether it mattered that Howard hadn’t actually uttered these words.
Over here enough of us certainly understood what he was on about, and I’d like to think we got the message and voted against him and his government accordingly.
One thing is clear: overseas there is a gaggle of right wingers who hold Howard up as some kind of pro-Christian, pro-English language, pro-Western, anti-Muslim superhero. They are circulating emails extolling his virtues, to the point of making up quotations he uttered.
But as I wrote above: are they so inaccurate?
Is this how he was seen by the rest of the world? Is this how Australians were seen by the rest of the world?
Probably not… but it certainly gave me pause for concern.
Goodbye John. Thanks for nothing.
Oh yes, and Pies is back on Heiner… again.
This time it “implicates” the new GG: startling new allegations, criminal conspiracy etc. etc.
Why does he bother?
Abbott on Meet the Press on ten, repeating the myth that Costello is the greatest treasurer ever and that the Howard-Costello combination as the best ever. The Libs believe that continually repeating a myth, it will become a reality. After every interview Abbott has, he goes to confession to confess his lies to the Australian people.
359
Even on the rapidly sliding ‘Insiders’ (inside their own little world) Abbot was only worth about 5 seconds of giggling.
His low profile has lead to a double dose of irrelevancy.
358 BB
Because otherise he will have to start THINKING about what to write?
Howard’s legacy. Sounds legit, tho Howard would never ever be that honest in speaking, because it captures the reactionary spirit. These frightened people resist change because change implies growth.
354 Dyno. Bullbutter! We just talked about the Anzac Day speeches.
Hmmm Rofe audit? Bullbutter!
I doubt there is any ‘constitutional crisis.’ God’s sake!
And Pies just repeats all the discredited crap, that Heiner investigated abuse claims etc. False! BS! BB!
354 Dyno – now come on Dyno that argument is too simplistic and you know it. People aren’t calling Howard indecent purely on their opposition to his ideas, it’s against the content of the idea and/or its delivery and motive they find distasteful. I get the feeling you’ll defend him to the death on everything he did. My, how sensitive we are, too sensitive. May be there is some truth in what some people believe eh?
“Is this how he was seen by the rest of the world? Is this how Australians were seen by the rest of the world?”
I was living in Europe from 2004 to 2007, and yes, Australians were increasingly being viewed as a bunch of racist rednecks.
That impression might take a while to disappear, but at least we are free of Howard, and ready to chart a different course.
Most Australians believe in God.
I stopped reading that drivel right there. Neither God nor any religion is a noticeable part of most in my immediate community.
It is true that in ABS surveys that the vast majority of Australians identify themselves with a religion (mostly Christian), but that is nowhere near the same as saying they are genuine believers. Just check church attendance figures, the numbers attending church services (at least once a week) in Australia has been falling seriously and persistently for decades, and is now just a small minority (around 10%, if memory serves).
We are probably the most non-religious society on earth. Which is fine by me.
And speaking of the God Squad:
http://www.smh.com.au/news/national/pay-cut-moan-only-a-joke-abbott/2008/04/27/1209234624813.html
Check the photo of him they used.
Bushfire Bill @ 357 – There are versions of that claiming to have been said by a right wing politician from most western/predominantly Christian countries. This seems to identify the initial source: http://www.breakthechain.org/exclusives/beamerican.html
JM @ 366,
Just a joke. Just like his advice to the gone but unlamented Jackie Kelly in Lindsay to treat the Muslim pamphlet as a “Chaser” like prank.
The only way you know that Abbott is lying is that his mouth is open, his tongue is flapping and there is noise coming out.
Just Me. I read both your earlier postings & like other bloggers when it come to to the subject matter of religion or God a sharp critical objectionist POV arises with some self righteous bile as well to sooth their “God complex” views.
Myself I do believe but I dont go out to do “dump jobs” on others that may have an opposing view. Usually I have found those who are critical but not always are those who have never done a serious study on the matter of God or religion but are the first to throw stones at anyone who is. Are you one of them.
I am not passing any aspersions upon you as also their are those who are religious who are also ignorant on a lot of topics too. Its a subject that is not easily breached at a political blog as any debate can be argued & counter argued for days. I’m just saying to put the “mongrel away” !
Just me at 339
“Howard is a lip-licker.”
Nah!
Howard is an arse-licker.
Usually I have found those who are critical but not always are those who have never done a serious study on the matter of God or religion but are the first to throw stones at anyone who is. Are you one of them.
No. I was raised a Catholic, church every Sunday and before Xmas presents on Xmas day, First Communion, grace before every meal, the whole schtick, and several decades later I can still recite the Lord’s Prayer from memory.
But I never believed a word of it, and left the church and religion behind a long time ago, as soon as I was able, a choice I have never regretted. (Though I remain grateful to the various religions for the wonderful music they have given us over the centuries, and I also acknowledge the Bible’s often sublimely poetic language.)
Yes, I believe that the religious view (especially the metaphysical and teleological aspects) is a false view of the world (albeit one genuinely held by many), and that it does not ultimately advance the human species, and indeed that it is starting to seriously hold us back.
I also think it is not necessary to be religious to be an ethical person and live a decent life.
So be it.
Oops, only the first paragraph of #371 should be in italics.
Hmmmm I have sent an email to PM Rudd about this attack on our next GG. Rudd can get the AG to take action without him having to take any part.
Someone like Rudd, who voluntarily enters public life, may be a legitemate target for public villification. Someone like Ms Bryce who takes up a ceremonial post, or a politicians wife, is not.
Oh god no, not relgion & politics – I fear all the micks and closet micks (ex and current) a going to have a say, even if they don’t really, really wan’t to ….
This just shows that Abbott and the rest of the LNP Opposition just don’t get it whatsoever.
And this business of trying to deflect blame onto McLachlan when it was their own collective cowadice that they didn’t ditch Howard and try to bring their policies more in line with what the mainstream electorate were seeking is just arrant nonsense.
http://www.news.com.au/story/0,23599,23605512-2,00.html
There’s no problem unless someone else reveals it, and even then they’re not sure…
And then ‘people skills’ comes out with this:
“There’s nothing wrong with our values, there’s nothing wrong with our instincts, but we’ve got to apply them anew to contemporary problems,” he said.
That’s almost Nelson-esque
Not when it involved trying to stay entrenched in the one position that had been his lifelong dream.
And there was no way Hyacinth was going to move from the luxury of Kiribilly and the social standing they had become accustomed to, what with being able to entertain lavishly at taxpayer’s expense ($36,000 wine cellar, servants etc) and what about the view.
All this in between staying in luxury accommodation on the numerous overseas trips. Poor old “Tip” & spouse didn’t quite meet up with the high standards necessary to receive an invite. No wonder he opted out of picking up the pieces. I hope to hear much more on this in the upcoming book. Just hope it’s not going to be a novel. Fiction?
onimod, did you notice on “Insiders” that they picked up on Nelson’s constant backflips and changing of position.
Looks as though he has set a trend now. The rest of them are starting to do it now too.
Lol, this is fun. Watching this mob flip, flop and spin themselves inside out is better than any Comedy Company production.
I hope some astute writer is taking copious notes. The period from 24th November, 2007 through to the next election should provide enough material for a fascinating read. A must for any coffee table.
I assume all you young laborites won’t be able to drink anymore now that our glroious leader has doubled the tax on alcohol. I’m sure he has your best interests at heart – more time for dedication to the cause. Praise the Krudd.
378
I’ve commented on the for of their behaviour before, but it really does look like a race to the bottom. There’s this weird belief that the only way you can unseat a sitting labour government is to be responsible for uncovering or ‘creating’ some sort of scandal. The politicians seem to want to be journalists, and the journalists want to be politicians.
Neither seem to be good enough at their jobs to be able to show the other the way.
Since when in Australia did the the person yelling the loudest get the attention? That seems to me, to be an importation of American culture that I just don’t think is having the same effect here. It just seems so easy in Australian culture for the smartarse at the back of the bar to cut the overly emotional pontificating w@^ker down to size with a clean and incisive comment.
And this isn’t just going on Federally. Apparently there’s a scandal every day of the week in Canberra at the moment (it’s an election year). At he moment it’s the contract for flying balloons….seriously.
I really don’t give a hoot how emotional a politician is – it’s the facts, and the fact that the Liberal oppositions are branding themselves as factless whiners is more than a little disturbing. They’re either getting woeful advice or they’re just plain stupid and disconnected from Australia.
There is a time for negativity in politics, but it’s a shock tactic; generally best saved for late in a campaign. The day in day out ‘look at me, look at meeee’ manufacturing of scandals and disasters (that seemingly don’t affect day-to-day life in Australia) is a simple as the story of chicken little.
People aren’t listening because there’s nothing worth listening to any more.
Bargearse @ 379 -
The tax hasn’t been doubled on alcohol generally, only premixed drinks which brings the excise back to that charged for other spirit products.
Why Costello reduced the excise on just premix back in 2000 is a mystery. Maybe they’re his fav tipple.
Anyway, all good “laborites” – of whatever age – should be drinking the working man’s booze, beer!
onimod, The electorate had made their decision long before Nov 24th. They decided that they had had enough of Howardism, Rudd & his team looked the goods and they felt comfortable in giving Labor the opportunity to run the place for a while.
Once that decision was made, they are content to just get on with life and let the new Government get on with whatever is necessary in running the country. They have had enough of politicking, what with Howard’s 365 days a year campaigning for 11.5 years and will take a bit of a look during the next election campaign, but will probably be quite content to let Rudd carry on with his agenda.
It really won’t matter what the Libs and their MSM supporters try to spin over this electoral cycle, the punters have tuned out. The only way that that could be turned around is with a colossal stuff-up bu Rudd, and that is very unlikely. He is too smart an operator to let this opportunity slip due to a major stuff-up. He’ll revert to “cruise control” rather than let that happen.
For the moment, and into the foreseeable future, the Libs are a non-entity and a non-event.
381 MF
Preferably BEER he brewed himself
If anyone drinks bacardi fizz with strawberry tang they deserve to be taxed triple.
Completely off topic but has anyone else noticed Woolies owned bottle shops have taken on the petrol pricing model for beer?
30 VB cans at my local $40 Fri-Sat-Sun, $48 other days of the week. Please explain?
Thx for spoiling my evening, ruawake. VB! {Shudder}
A bit of trivia: You can buy the Aussie made pre mixed drinks at supermarkets here in China (sans the tax). If anyone is hanging out for bacardi fizz with strawberry tang The Peoples Republic is the place for you. I can’t wait to get back home and have some Aussie beer
P.S I love VB
Howard, with his Cold War-type suspicions of ‘the other’, and his 18th century workplace fantasies, was truly a man of the past.
It took a long time, but eventually Australia put him into its past, and no place did suit him better.
It appears to me that the Murdoch press is in the midst of a campaign to undermine the credibility of the RBA and its Governor. Trying to personally attack him, the mechanism the RBA uses, its decision making, if it knows what it is doing and so forth.
Extraordinary really considering it was until a short time ago sacrosanct. Maybe Murdoch’s zombie ‘journalists’ are still upset rates were increased during the election or more likely, upset the Turnbull is making a total ass of himself trying to attack the RBA and Treasury. So the OO and its siblings are taking over the Treasurer’s role as well as Nelson’s role.
The whole purpose is of course to have the public believe the RBA is getting it wrong, that interest rates rises were not necessary and that the Howard govt was right all along and was ‘framed’ by the RBA…etc.
Into the mix you have to ask if Bernie Fraser has got his head screwed on right. It must have been obvious to him that the press was trying to attack the RBA and its governor and undermine it .. yet he comes out and gains says the RBA. Wonder if he can remember when he was Governor and how he would have liked his predecessor making ‘unhelpful’ comments.
And of course Abbott’s line that Swan was talking up inflation and thus put pressure on the RBA to lift rates just shows you how low and stupid he is. But of course it is all in tune with what the Murdoch press is trying to do…and also implies personal weakness on the part of the Governor.
However, during the election campaign, Howard’s pressure on the RBA over rates didn’t stop them raising them…so that makes Abbott’s contention that the RBA reacts to government pressure look ridiculous.
388 Kina
must
blame
someone
…
anyone
Frankly – it’d do my head in having to follow that process
Kina
I don’t think the reserve bank should be beyond criticism, many are looking at Greenspan who was previously hailed a genius and a steady hand as not exercising enough control, sort of a hands off approach.
The whole credit borrowing market was allowed to run free, there should have been some control.
Pointing the finger at the RBA is easy but misplaced. The current inflationary cycle is much like the the 1970’s, and has similar causes. In the 1960’s, the USA became embroiled in a hugely expensive war and failed to raise taxes to finance it. Excessive military and domestic spending by the USA combined with loose monetary policy produced an enormous build up in spending and US-denominated debt and led in quick time to soaring commodity prices and ultimately to USD-depreciation and the collapse of the Bretton Woods currency system. The collapse in the dollar had its corollary: soaring commodity prices.
A similar train of events is occurring now: grossly irresponsible US spending, loose monetary policy (and even looser regulation of lending) and negligent fiscal policies have fed unsustainable investment and consumption booms all around the world and to a very steep decline in the USD.
The result is worldwide inflation in the prices of staple products. The credit market crunch in the US and Europe has slowed these economies, but not yet by enough to sap demand to the point where prices decline. Imagine what inflation would be like if the credit crisis had not knocked the guts out of consumer demand in the US.
The real culprit here is the grossly incompetent, war-making, tax-cutting, lie-telling Bush Administration.
The collapse of the USD is bad for Americans: their staple products cost them more, eating away at real living standards. But it’s tough on everyone else too. Anyone who needs to get USD in order to buy those same staples – especially food and energy – is in trouble. If you’re heavily into the traded goods economy (and luckily, Australia is) you will get the benefits of nominal price appreciations and favourable currency moves. But if you are not a beneficiary of demand for these goods, you are going to suffer ruinously high prices and, as we’ve seen in some countries, shortages of staple products.
By allowing a weak dollar policy, the Bush Adminsitration has exported part of the costs of its appaling mismanagement to the world’s poor.
Australian families will not be exempt from these pressures, even if their worst effects will be mitigated to some degree.
For commentary on supply/ demand…
http://www.usda.gov/oce/commodity/wasde/latest.pdf
Blindoptimist,thank you for your insightful explaination of the role the criminal Bush regime is playing in yet another unfolding tragedy. Will our interest rate adjustments and other spending measures have much impact on these external drivers of inflation?
Whoever has the control over the U.S. currency printing presses is behaving like a drunk in a brewery.
Ahh – Allbull has realised there is a problem [and no mention of it being Swan's fault - interesting]:
http://www.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/story/0,22049,23607434-5001021,00.html
“These are very tough times for borrowers because we are going into globally very tough times,” Mr Turnbull told The Daily Telegraph.
He said home prices had declined 11 per cent over the past year and there were predictions they would fall by 35 per cent in the US before the economic hard times eased.
“The implications for Australia are very considerable. There is a lot of pain in Australia that is going to come out of the US.”
and then this:
http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2008/04/28/2228767.htm
Mr Turnbull says the significant cooling in the US economy will flow through to Australia.
“I think the Treasurer’s got to be very careful not to be too Scrooge-like with the Federal Budget,” he said.
“I’m saying there is a lot of grief coming in from outside Australia and this is a time for us here in economic management to be cautious.
“We shouldn’t be rushing into measures, be they monetary or fiscal, that could, in effect, overdo the downward pressure on economic activity that’s coming from the rest of the world.”
The comments over at the ABC seem to be reasonably insightful and both sides of the argument seem to get a run. People do seem to be keen to be on the record predicting one thing or the other though.
Liam, I really think the global economy is in serious trouble. The contractionary shockwaves from the credit crunch are very dangerous. So far the reserve banks have been able to keep the commercial banking system liquid and have averted outright seizure in lending. But if asset values keep on shrinking and lending continues to ebb, then the real economy will become ever more sluggish. The process of de-leveraging will become more prolonged and more pervasive and lead to further contractionary pressures on the real economy.
At the same time, the USD is looking ever more tattered and debased, so the increasing USD-denominated prices of consumer staples will eat away at real incomes in the US. This will intensify the contractionary pressure in the US economy, leading to further de-leveraging, renewed flight from risk, further turbulence in the debt markets and further rounds of currency devaluation.
The integrated nature of the global credit and currency markets means these pressures are very quickly transmitted from one economy to another. The situation in Australia is nowhere near as severe as the US, but we can already see conflicting forces: inflation pushing prices up and gouging real incomes; credit contraction eroding asset values; higher interest rates weighing on credit demand, investment and consumption.
My personal opinion is the collapse in the housing market in the US, the UK and elsewhere has the potential to provoke a very prolonged period of contraction. It will be characterized by de-leveraging, first in the financial sector, then in the household sector and finally in the government sector. Central banks will be playing a balancing game for years: keeping the sytem liquid, averting collapses, but aiming to achieve positive real interest rates. Their basic fixations will be achieving system maintenance and price stability. Output and employment will come second. There is no overnight fix for this. It will take several years to accomplish, all going well.
Chaser APEC Charges Dropped.
http://www.news.com.au/perthnow/story/0,21598,23609110-5005361,00.html
Frank @ 398, hooray for some sanity and common sense in the hallowed halls of the legal profession. While I sometimes think the Chaser boys do go too far in their occasional juvenile pranks, they do perform the essential service of reminding us when indeed ‘the emperor has no clothes’. More power to them I say, I hope they are returning to the ABC, we will need them!
Has anyone seen Pies’ blog on Heiner?
Abso-bloody-lootley un-be-effing-lieveable. The bile and venom that comes out of that man and his acolytes.
Malignant windbag, indeed…
BB, save yourself an ulcer, Follow your own advice. Ignore.
Bushfire Bill @#400
If those creeps at Pies’ blog had their way there would never be a change of government. The mere talk of it would bring stern censure, if not a dawn visit from thugs wearing brown shirts.
Pies is irrelevant to everybody except those that hate everything except Howard and, he is a joke among his own kind.
He clings to his dark corner of the spider web stewing in his own bitter and putrid bile. The more irrelevant a person becomes the more vicious their attempts – Pies is probably on the verge of being retired as even the demographic he appeals to is getting smaller and smaller.
Piers gets a tremendous amount of responses to his topics and does not (recently) censor the replies.
It was the non censorship approach that increased the traffic by about a factor of nine on his blog which saw the entries and popularity increase.
You may not like him, but he is not irrelevant, especially if things get tougher.
Out of 30 posts I have made on his last two blogs two, TWO have made it.
He is censoring.
In fact this last blog of his one of the right whingers who post there said “It seems like the Rudd defenders have retreated” Nope just being censored.
I have tried to make about 6 comments on Piers blog over the last year or so. All of them critical of his position. None of them remotely offensive or inappropriate, especially not compared the stuff from his hardcore supporters that got through.
Not one of my comments got published, and I have heard way too many similar stories from those making critical comments of him.
He has a very thin and hypocritical skin and censors heavily. No doubt about that.
Just like Bolt, Blair, etc.
Circle jerks.
Re 405, 406. 407 do we need a site where comments that have been rejected. by Piers can be posted?
We already have The Blair/Bolt Watch Project site, may be we need an Akerman Watch site. Trouble is it might make him well known.
Hmmm be nice to let people know only some messages get through, easy too, just compose me in Notepad or Stickies and posting twice.
Been trying to get this posted:
“In relation to the Heiner case, the State Archivist has stated unequivocally that her assessment of the records did not reveal to her the existence of any inmate abuse allegations.
http://www.archivists.org.au/asa-position-statement-heiner-affair“
I think there was an Ackerman Watch site a while ago, and it is in the web archives somewhere. But it died from lack of interest, he just isn’t that important.
The best thing to do is just ignore him and let him disappear up his own sad irrelevance. He is beyond redemption.
Darryl Mason has a very good blog where he keeps an eye on Fatterman, the Dolt, etc.
http://theorstrahyun.blogspot.com/
Piers Akerman
http://theorstrahyun.blogspot.com/search/label/Piers%20Akerman
Andrew Bolt
http://theorstrahyun.blogspot.com/search/label/Andrew%20Bolt
http://www.byronbayinstitute.net/StoogeWatch/PiersAkerman.html
Please don’t laugh, this is serious.
Apparently WA Leader of Her Majesty’s Loyal Opposition, the Right Honourable Troy Buswell, he of bra strap twanging fame, reknown tippler, and sometime wearer of viking helmets, has added a new dimension to his stellar reputation as a lad about town and bon viveur.
His latest alleged exploit puts a new perspective on Mr Latham’s description of John Howard as an arse licker, and opens up a vast opportunity for some wag to coin a new epithet, challenging even Mr. Latham’s descent into the depth of vulgar phrasiology.
You see, the Honourable Member has been accused of publicly sniffing the recently vacated and still warm seat of an Honourable Liberal Memberette, much to the consternation of some, if not all, of those present.
The mind boggles, but at least we can take some solace from the fact that it is not alleged he was drunk at the time…
Thanks for the link 413Thomarse. I think we can see why they gave Piers the flick.
“We are a left wing think tank originally formed to see the end of John Howard. Mission accomplished. Obviously there were many punters out there who were thinking along the same lines. Congratulations to Australia! We may now resume normal transmission.”
Pies is irrelevant and I wonder just how long they will keep him. His obsession with nonsense, ignorance and plain old bitterness are just a little too far out. He is that sort of unpleasant uncle they keep locked away in a little dark room in one of the highest towers of a castle, only accessed by one narrow stone stair case. Maybe he escaped from a 1930s black and white movie.
This should make some of the worriers feel a little more relaxed.
Budget to commit $13bn to water projects
Federal Water Minister Penny Wong says next fortnight’s budget will contain plans to spend just under $13 billion on water projects over the next 10 years.
http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2008/04/29/2229747.htm?section=justin
My booboo, it wasn’t a memberette’s seat, it was a staffers. And, as Mr Buswell himself says he isn’t going to comment on unsustatiated, anonymous rumours (even to deny them), we’ll have to wait and see what futher transpires …..
See the video on the West’s webpage.
Fulvio,
Ch 9 Perth’s midnight rplay of the 6pm News is on shortly so we’ll see which of the two stories between Sniffwell and Burke’s latest email “scandal” gets more coverage.
I note the Sniffwell story was leaked by people inside the Liberal Party itself – it seems they are still not happy about him being elected leader.
It looks like the state pres of the Fiberal Party isn’t denying the report – in fact he has basically confirmed its correctness if this quote is accurate:
“It’s not appropriate behaviour we’ve been through this before with bra strapping and it’s all over, it’s all finished.
“I mean I’ve seen people especially in my life with the Victory Life church they change daily you know.
“You see different people emerge and I’m sure in this case Troy’s realised the error of the ways and has certainly indicated to me that he’s changed.”
I’m not sure what the second paragraph means – it might be intended to suggest repentance.
All I can say is that the WA Fibs must be totally bereft of genuine talent if people like Buswell can rise to the top.
http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2008/04/28/2228870.htm
Col. Moe Davis, the former chief prosecutor for the Guantanamo military tribunals admits the whole process is “tainted by political influence and evidence obtained through prisoner abuse.”
He also says this about David Hicks:
Davis testified that he had “inherited” the Hicks case from a previous prosecutor and would not otherwise have charged him because he wanted to focus on cases serious enough to merit 20 years in prison. The Hicks case did not meet that test, he said.
http://www.newsdaily.com/stories/n4l282271-guantanamo-hearings/
Meanwhile the real war criminals and corruption facilitators not only remain free but continue to be media ‘darlings’
Just got an email from Pies
“Your inability to supply factual material renders your submissions unpublishable.”
Ummm I replied, you just don’t like the facts I supply.
So one rule (’factual evidence’–that Pies is comfortable with) for the lefties and another (spew bile & venom & hatred and be as Off Topic as you like for the right whingers)
I will send a complaint to the Daily Terror and to the Press Council.
Speaking of talent and integrity, Gary Clark, husband of former MP Jacki Kelly and one of those charged with distributing the fake leaflets in the last election campaign, has just pleaded not guilty in court. It was just a harmless prank after all?
Andrew Bolt on Troy Buswell.
Some of those posters have no clue
Attending a Strip Club is slightly different to snapping bra straps and sniffing female body odour.
For once I agree with Bolt. This repugnant individual (Buswell) should now take a long walk off of a short plank and allow the party to try and recover some degree of respectability with the WA public.
422 Thomarse – keep at them Thomarse.
But who will they replace him with – Rob Johnston, who almost had the numbers is a loose cannon and is known to have an obsession with people having sex with animals, amongst other things.
#423 Socrates, the following report has Kelly’s husband pleading guilty …
http://www.thewest.com.au/default.aspx?MenuID=145&ContentID=70370
Thomarse #422, good on ya, keep fighting the good fight against the hateful fatterman.
Re #429: Sorry, not Kelly’s husband; Chijoff’s husband…
Sniffwell puts on the tears, but won’t resign. If he did this in the Private Sector he would be up for Sexual Harrassment and be sacked from his job.
http://www.news.com.au/perthnow/story/0,21598,23615760-948,00.html
So we’re responsible for paying for his life while he ‘rehabilitates himself…maybe’.
I would have thought being a decent human being would have been one of the core criteria of his job.
To coin the Big Brother catch phrase – ‘I don’t think so’
In the real world this would be labelled as a clear case of over promotion ans gross misconduct.
If he worked for a reasonable organisation he’d be given the opportunity to resign. Otherwise it would have been the usual treatment: a senior member of the organisation would have accompanied him to his desk, logged the items he chose to remove, and escorted him from the building.
It’s no wonder the general public has dwindling respect for politicians. I like the way he’s managed to drag his colleagues down with him by claiming their support. If it’s actually true then they all deserve a ‘fresh start’ somewhere else.
Can you imagine the response of the right wing blog masters if this had been a Labor man going through this humiliation? They wouldn’t be showing any mercy. Hell they went haywire over Rudd supposedly eating his earwax.
They’d want him sacked yesterday and be kicked out of the party followed by criminal charges being laid, hopefully resulting in Gaol time – and being placed on the Sex Offenders Register
meh!.. sniffing chairs is sooo 2005
Does Buswell have a screw lose? Why on earth would you do such a thing if you’re a public figure? Are the WA Liberals that short on talent that he is the best their got? I’m puzzled….. but then again they do things differently in the West.
Thomarse, thanks for the link to the Byron Bay Institute, some great articles by one of my favourite writers, Mungo. Have bookmarked, a gem!
Hmm, there are reports that Matt Birney may be asked to be leader AGAIN !!!
http://www.news.com.au/perthnow/comments/0,21590,23618493-948,00.html
Can someone tell me what the ALP was thinking when they choose their candidate for Gippsland? I can understand standing a candidate who has just joined the party if they are good, but after seeing their candidate on the 7.30 Report, I can’t see why this seemed like a good idea in this case. His major platform is independence of local government, so I am not sure how he’ll cope with the party rules.
If the Labor members of East Gippsland had any sense they would should not help him during the election and on election day. Why should they when their views are not being heard.
Frank
Great comment on the Birney story that Butwell was looking for a new seat.
Speaking of Buswell, it was only last week that the WA Liberals started running these ads.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=RvKJ3NTDrhA
B. S. Fairman. I personally cannot comprehend how a political party of any persuasion, can allow some one like this to survive, let alone go on leading a major party.
436
B.S. Fairman Says:
April 29th, 2008 at 6:10 pm
Does Buswell have a screw lose?.
…..
He is, amazingly, the best of the bunch. It’s as if he’s the guest in a Seinfeld episode: “Just one Sniff”.
They are not much good for much, but at least we get a laugh from them!
WA Labor should be able to sniff out a good story. This story really is on the nose. The guy will be the butt of many jokes. I wonder how safe his own seat is!
437
Basil Fawlty
No probs! I had a fascinating time last night finding stuff like that!
I know the story leads to many puns, but what do our WA pollbludgers think are the chances of him going because of it?
Wong vs Tony Jones…(again)
Does Tony just not want to talk about the big issues?
What’s with all the hypotheticals?
Why is he soooo damn keen to drive wedges into water?
He’s going to ask her about graffiti, or why she personally didn’t buy a bigger spade to fill in irrigation channels last week at Bunnings. Good grief.
We’re a long way from dotting I’s and crossing T’s Tony you dolt – we’ve had 12 years of people not even admitting they were part of the problem. The key policy movement is toward inclusiveness of all stakeholders – not the apportionment of blame.
There’s no Watergate Pulitzer in water policy. Give it up.
Has Sniffergate been featured on Lateline ?
I reckon WA Poltics is defined by 2 things – Brian Burke on the ALP side, and Troy Buswell for the Libs.
No wonder the WA Nationals have walked away from the Coalition and have no plans on forming one in the future – Expect Buswell to lose his seat in a 3 cornered contest.
Sniffer! Get a job at the airport! Though sadly, the dedicated dogs may be contaminated by association.
The wowsers are at it again. Thinking a distasteful pseudo-sexual act is sufficient for resignation.
Can’t see the fuss over this Sniffergate thing.
Plenty of worse things than that have happened in this big wide world.
The public must be getting totally bored with politics by now, that we have had our campaign, election, Rudd’s tour, 2020, the US elections and so on…people are totally full. The May budget will be just about the limit of it before people switch off entirely, content that Rudd is in charge and seems ok.
Sniffing chairs is kinda embarrassing. Well at least he waited for the person to vacate the chair first (I hope). Hope she hadn’t had a meal of baked beans before hand.
I SNIFF the strong SCENT of defeat in the air for the Libs in the upcoming WA State election.
Many SEATS maybe at risk, with many ARSES on the line for the Liberal Party. West Australians may finally give the state libs the BUM’s rush over this affair, while the Labor Party comes out of it SMELLING like roses.
Thank you, Thank you.
451
I certainly don’t consider myself a wowser BB, but I do think that it’s unacceptable behaviour.
Do you seriously think you could get away with that in private industry?
I agree that plenty worse has happened. I’m not sure that the bar should be that low though.
I’m a wowser, then, BB.
Such behaviour is enough to wonder at a person’s fitness for office.
Standards, BB!
Whilst it is not the lowest of behaviour we have been forced to endure. Same as, however. It doesn’t really matter whether its sniffing chairs, gaoling without trial, detaining without reason, deporting because you feel like it. All the same.
Complete disrespect. Indicative.
onimod at 448. I am just as annoyed at Tony Jones. But I am filled with anxiety about the Murray Darling. And the Murray, as far as SA is concerned. Whatever Labor does, common sense, tough action and water are the imperatives.
The political thing is the absolute neglect of these imperatives, the neglect of which is assignable not only to the Howard Government, which helped drive it out of office.
Sanguine, that Government, but all Governments, it seems. The people have been far ahead in perception of the looming disaster.
This Government has to pick up on the very, very hard tasks. I hope that they can and do. And I hope that the people can handle it. As we must.
Well, BB, it is not so much that act itself that is the issue, it is the hypocrisy of it that this is really all about. I mean, aren’t the conservatives supposed to be the bearers of (absolute) moral standards in our society? They certainly never pass up any opportunity to tell us that they are, and that we should follow their noble example.
So when it turns out they are not, I say give ‘em hell over it. In this case, for about a week. Then forget it. The damage will have been done, and Troy SniffSeat will never recover.
The Liberals in Brisbane city Hall have just given us the best example of voodoo economics and planning in Australia’s history with the release of the revised plan for the much despised Hale street bridge fiasco. Now the Liberals announce a massive scaling down of the project but with increased costs, increased rates for the ratepayer. can someone explain how such a ludicrous thing can occur. surely if a program is scaled down it becomes cheaper. Or were the maths and the planning always dodgy? The whole proposal is so dodgy it should be scrapped immediately.
http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/news/queensland/50-million-hale-street-blow-out/2008/04/29/1209234826717.html
I’m not saying that what Whatshisname did in WA wasn’t gross, but we’ve all done those kinds of things in the heat of the moment. I’d like to see anyone on this blog claim otherwise. I’ll be the first to put my hand up as being a sinner, but I hope I’ve benefited from my mistakes and made proper restitution to anyone I’ve offended.
Life (if youse will excuse the philosophy) is a series of good and bad behaviors. We learn from the bad, and hopefully the good outweighs the bad.
I guess I’m annoyed that a few disgruntled Lib apparatchiks can simply release the news of a questionable act or a You Tube of the event and expect – accurately in this case – that the public will react with moral horror. The ease with which minor sexual or social mishaps can be morphed or manipulated into public indignation is what disappoints me. This is what happened in the Brogden and Andrew Bartlett cases.
The incident inthis case was between the bloke and the woman in question and she has apparently forgiven him for it. No harm was done (it wasn’t a violent act), so the consequences are essentially personal. It was closer to a faux pas than a hanging offence (in my opinion) and I think politicians – or anyone for that matter, male or female – should be allowed the odd transgression before community opprobrium winds itself up into full high dudgeon… as long as the path to redemption is generally in the forwards direction for the transgressors.
If there was a pattern of this kind of behavior it would be a different matter. But that’s not alleged as far as I know.
459
Bushfire Bill
So making rational and convincing arguments
Your spoiling all the fun
err, So=Stop
Andrews is distancing himself from the AFP investigations into the Haneef affair which begins today. Mick Keelty will be left to carry the can – unless of course he rats on the Rodent and his minister. Keelty is in this position because he was willing to act as a mouthpiece for the former toxic government – serves him right:
http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,23620701-601,00.html
“Mr Andrews will tell the Rudd government-ordered inquiry into the bungled case, which opens today, that Australian Federal Police did not inform him of evidence debunking allegations against Dr Haneef’s second-cousin Sabeel Ahmed – allegations that had led to the subsequent terrorism charge against the Gold Coast doctor.
The testimony of Mr Andrews to the inquiry, headed by retired NSW Supreme Court judge John Clarke QC, will raise questions about whether the AFP ignored the vital information or, in fact, if it was ever passed on to Australian investigators after it is believed to have been discovered by British police, days after the failed London nightclub and Glasgow airport bombings in June last year.
Mr Andrews’ evidence to the inquiry will effectively leave AFP Commissioner Mick Keelty on his own in explaining the detention and charging of Dr Haneef, given that the case against the Indian-born doctor fell apart soon after his arrest on July 2 as he attempted to board a flight out of Brisbane for his native Bangalore.”
New NSW Newspoll available today – except that its more of the same…
PRIMARY VOTE LABOR LIBERAL NATS LIB/NAT GRNS OTHERS
March 24 2007 39.0 26.9 10.1 37.0 9.0 15.0
Jan – Mar 2008 34 34 5 39 14 13
Mar – Apr 2008 35 35 3 38 14 13
* 4 percent “uncommitted” and 1 percent “refused” excluded
But story in the Tele does suggest that Morris is heading for a train wreck over electricity privatisation:
http://www.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/story/0,22049,23620033-5001021,00.html
The Ruddster is continuing to raise the bar:
Rudd puts public fat cats on notice
http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,23622244-601,00.html
With attutudies like this he just might receive free and fearless advice from the public service – something that Howard and Co neither welcomed nor tolerated.
I heard that on Newsradio! Don’t you love it?
http://www.smh.com.au/news/world/father-of-lsd-takes-final-trip/2008/04/30/1209234917556.html
“With attutudies like this he just might receive free and fearless advice from the public service – something that Howard and Co neither welcomed nor tolerated.”
The fearless and frank public servant is a bit of myth, like the “noble savage”, idealised but never found.
Public servants look after themselves, Rudd knows this as he said.
“I should warn you that when it comes to my dealings with the public service, my background probably doesn’t make me more sympathetic – just more suspicious.’’
Bill – 39 years old is a bit late to be learning those lessons. In fact I’d say the chances of him unlearning that behaviour at that age is pretty slim without an awful lot of professional help.
Umm, actually, Bushie B. it would seem that the high jinks and jolly japes perpetrated on female persons in the vicinity of the honorable leader of Her Maj’s Opposition in W.A., is not an isolated event. Evidence is drunken bra snapping Labor person in October last year – probably only tip of a completely different iceberg! I agree with Onimod, and frankly, another narcissistic personality disordered individual on my couch would be one too many.
Sure people are just flawed humans, but if the W.A. Libs. have nothing better to offer, they’re on wood.
Having just the footage of Buswell crying for the first time, Did his mascara run? And why on earth is he wearing mascara?
Oh and Brendon Nelson has come out in support of Sniffwell.
Watch his support fall into negative figures, especially amongst female voters.
B.S. Fairman. I admit to mascara dependency, however, Buswell’s psychopatholgy is not something I’d want to explore. Would you?
Can someone tell me how Mick Keelty made it this far?
Check out the quote from him on ‘robot criminals’ on Wikipedia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mick_Keelty
Hmmm, reality, who needs it?
472
Harry – just check out the specific language that the Sniffwell used in his press conference and tell me he’s not ‘on-the-couch’ on a regular basis?
Not that that itself is necessarily a bad thing.
Sniffwell may be challenged as Leader.
http://www.news.com.au/perthnow/story/0,21598,23625563-5005361,00.html
Here one of a cast of 1000’s of Political incorrect talk! – :8
http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/articles/2008/05/01/1209235002632.html
onimod from last night at 474, sorry I didn’t respond, had to check out due to much on today. If Buswell has been in therapy, it’s clearly not doing much good. It reminds me of a cartoon of a woman on the couch, with therapist on chair nearby, saying, ” Miss Brown, my summing up of your problem, after ten years therapy, is that you have more money than sense”. Boom, tish. Or another, of man saying to therapist, “Then she called me an egotist, and went home to my mother in law”.
Love Half Nelson’s support for Buswell. Could his PPM drop to where the MoE is meaningless?
Very VERY, disappointed tonight to see Rudd commenting on the Sydney Harbour tragedy.
Can someone please tell him he is NOT the “Father Of The Nation”, and does not need to punctuate our daily lives with homilies on how our wonderful harbour can bring forth tragedy as well as joy etc. etc.
Next thing he’ll be answering quetion on disputed State of Origin tries.
No more, please!
(Faint hope of that, I think).
Catalyst had some pretty stark info on the MD tonight. Acid mud, pyrites ,when a flood comes the pyrites oxidise forming sulphuric acid. Can we really afford to allow all that irrigation in the headwaters of the Darling? Can we really afford to allow dairies living of MD irrigation water?
Think Rudd/Wong/Garret have much more thinking to do and hard decisions to make. The national party will howl the roof down if irrigated dairies are told to shut up shop. Compensation I guess will have to be paid? I always thought $10Bn over 10 years was petty cash. $100Bn this year be more in line with reality.
Akermann is discussing the Stolen Generation. Don’t go there, the half caste kids were happy to go, to leave their family where they were mistreated because they were half white. What a retard.
478 agreed
That was one of the worst parts of Howardism.
I suspect he’ll be doing anything he can to keep things off serious politics until the budget hits. They seem to be leaking crumbs in the hope that the journos won’t concoct a big negative. They’ve so far managed to keep the FOI story under the covers.
there’s obviously very little going on in the Nation at the moment. Who didn’t make a comment on the Harbour today?
5 people a day lose their live on the roads. That’s a tragedy and an outrage…isn’t it?
Tragedy and outrage, I suppose so… but no suitable material for Prime Ministerial commentary.
Rudd should steer away from this or else he’ll be being asked fatuous questions about stray dogs biting pedestrians, cricket controversies, third umpire decisions, trains running on time, driving hoons and potholes in Blacktown streets.
The country should be able to get on well without this kind of trivia eminating from the PM’s mouth. The Federal government does NOT run the country down to the smallest nut and bolt. Permitting local minutae to be put under the Rudd-O-Scope will come back to bite him and his government, as the delving into trivial detail by journalists for comment by the PM becomes more and more irrelevant to national affairs.
I personally don’t give a toss about the Harbour tragedy. I care about the young next door neighbour of mine who was killed instantly at a local black-spot intersection because I knew her well. I didn’t know any of the victims of the Harbour incident. Therefore, hard nosed as this may sound, their fates are of little import to my life.
People die in tragic circumstances every day. I am unlikely to ever be on the Harbour at night with fourteen other people overloading a glorified tinny without navigation lights (as alleged). I don’t like to see, “Sandy was so full of life” headlines as I did yesterday in the Telegraph. Sandy who? Someone called “Sandy” was killed in the accident. The Telegraph treats her as if she was Australia’s Sweetheart, overly personalising the whole situation.
It was the same as the woman who took bribes from developers at Woollongong Council. She had a first name too (which, thankfully, escapes me) and – in terms of this first name – was turned into some kind of heroine because she was swindled into having sex with a millionaire who wanted to get his development up and running under allegedly corrupt circumstances.
Every moment spent commenting on local storms in local teacups by the leader of the country diminishes him. It’s simply a matter of professionalism on Rudd’s part and, in my opinion, it was and will be a mistake for Rudd to fall for this Daily Telegraph approach to minor affairs, “tragic” as they may be in the local news environment.
481 yes indeed
As a post script to my last comment, think of what they did to Latham over the tsunami a coyuple of years back. The man was in agony with pancreatitis, doubled over in pain (although I hear even doubling over doesn’t help much). Yet he – as a recently heavily defeated Opposition Leader – wasn’t given the leeway that such a sick man deserved. No, he had to “comment” on the tsunami. He had to express the Opposition’s “condolences”, as useless as that would have been.
It wrecked his political career, all over a pointless exercise in pretending to be “horrified” and “prostrate with grief” about something over which he had no control and over which he would never have any control.
Latham, at the time, had other, real things to be prostrate over, yet no quarter was given to him by the press.
OK, so you can say there was a hidden agenda to get rid of Latham by hook or by crook. But Howard’s legitimising of this kind of running public heart-on-his-sleeve act made any hatchet job on Latham all the more possible.
Rudd should not fall for this, or else it will get him in the end too.
New Morgan thread up.