make up your mine , one minute “I’m more than abit More than a bit ingenuous in #99 , then 2 hours later in #101 ” more than a bit disingenuous” Given your claimed measured posting I can only conclude you believe I’m both

Frankly you hav reduced a complicated Geo politcal Georgian issue that had its more definitive roots at NATO meeting in april which agreeing to admit Georgia & Ukraine subject to doing due process , into a one liner blaming it all on a US presidential candidatte Such a notion would be regarded by any professional non partisan foreign affairs expert as absurb

In other posts you’ve displayed a strong anti ANZUS & anti US stanse regarding foreign affairs , and its your right to do so despite it representing a miniscule of ‘oz’ views However your latest alegation blaming maverick over Georgia would be more typical of extreme left marxists and is NOT th view of our Rudd government not th EU In fact th German & French pres hav publicly condemned Russia

What we do know Rrom russia’s invasion is th response of Bush mirrored by Obama was p.ssweak and appeasemement by both What we do know prior to invaion is Russia invaded another UN recognised sovereign Country , both facts you blithley ignore

What we do know pre invasion is separate 5 parties (Russia, Ossetians , EU , US & Georgia) had varying complicated responsibilitys for what occured & none of whom was McCain or Obama for that matter Clearly most responsibility & condemnation belongs with th invader Russia , with th other 4 partys not blameless either as I’ve previously said but to a varying lesser degree

This Country Russian you seem to think with anti american sentiment to hav same historic values & libertys as th 26 Nations making up th NATO & therefore worthy in your view to be regarded as a benign peace maker

Tell that to th 14 former Soviet dominated Countrys who gleefuly escaped Russia’s tyranny & genocides like th Polish , th chezs etc , who see EU & Nato as protecting there libertys from thuggish Russia , go to any of those countrys waving a Russian flag and anti US flag & see how much support you get , especialy th surviving families

Iraq …what you achieve with your illogical alegation is to allow th 100% defenders of US being 100% perfect in all things FA to sterotype ALL & any criticism of USA FA as coming from looney left marxists & to be disregarded , meaning those that ar legatimatekly condemning USA over its disgraceful Iraq invasion to be lumped with you & anti american sentimenjt , and therefore potentialy ignored You know Obama went to Afhganistan 7 its deteriorated since , & he’s to blame say some blogers , another absurd partissan point scoring US electon spin whch you’ve indulged in

Fact is AMONGST other Gep politcal factors there ar both gas & oil pipelines going through Georgia & there was to be Georgian NATO & EU membership , all of which ar above th influense of any US candidate , big powers decide these things but by all means post such blogs , you’ll convince no one on that basis

What is interesting is that, despite past criticism from growth-is-good economists, it seems the Club of Rome wasn’t so far wrong! The actual history has tracked pretty close to the “business as usual” case in their report. What has proved unrealistic were the “technology will fix it” scenarios. So much for all those CC denialists who say that global models are never right.

Soberingly, the Limits to Growth report projected major social collapse mid way through this century.

No Diogenes, have you read “What’s left”, by some journo in UK similar theme. Says the left sold out in its failure to challenge Islamic extremism.

I’m not even going to respond to that.

Have you (or anyone else) read “Murder in Amsterdam” by Buruma. It’s about the murder of Theo van Gogh by a Muslim extremist. It talks about what happens when Enlightenment/ liberal values are challenged by (in this case) Muslim fundamentalism. Liberal values are then caught in a paradox; they should tolerate and try to understand all opinions but this very tolerance can sew the seed of the destruction of a liberal society (either through terrorism, massive immigration of people who don’t share these ideals, or because of the rise of populist reactionary right-wing politicians who strongly oppose Muslim immigration).

It’s quite fascinating.