‘We think the appointment of Genghis is a coup for the club. Genghis’ past experience with young men and football at the highest level will ensure the future success of this football club, at least up to the time we all fail once more, Genghis is sacked, I resign, and the long suffering supporters of this football club elect a new set of tossers. (BTW, we’re hoping to pick up a Carey, Judd, Hird at the Victoria Markets this weekend).

Sheedy lifted sides in the 80’s, early 90’s and late 90’s (carrying into the 00’s). Winning a premiership with 3 distinct groups of players, at the same club, is an amazing feat. The last remnants of the zoning system probably gave the bombers more than any cap cheating did, but no other coach i have seen has won premierships with 2 very different groups of players, let alone three, so i think he deserves a lot of credit.

I don’t think Pagan did a good job at Carlton. He doesn’t appear to me to be a very good list manager. His record in every coaching job he had prior to the Carlton job is astonishingly good though.

I wouldn’t be happy for either of them to become coach at my club. Freo and Richmond both seem to have a desperate need to improve some basic things in their footy clubs (it is the only way to explain such continued failure in a league that has so many ‘evening up’ instruments). In a similar way to Barrassi’s stint in Sydney, i think that either could do a good job for a season or two for those clubs.

I think it is difficult to assess coaches. The job they need to do can be very different depending on their playing list.

Ross Lyon has a good quality and mature list at the Saints. He has been very successful at implementing his style of play, and that style is obviously effective. He has had success with mature recruits (eg Ray and Dawson). So far he has done a very good job.

Dean Bailey’s playing list is at the opposite end of the spectrum. He has a lot of young players playing decent footy for their level of experience. So he is doing exactly what i think he needs to do, but really that is the easy part, and the real insight will come when the list starts to mature.

Gary Ayres is a tricky one. I always perceived him as tactically naive. His win loss record was solid though, and he got his clubs to the finals often. Both at the Cats and the Crows he took over mature lists of a decent standard. Neither time did he seem to do a good job of guiding the evolution of the club though. His effort of getting the non-aligned VFL club Port Melbourne to the grand final last year was very impressive.

Terry Wallace took over a strong list at Footscray. He did very well with mature aged recruits, and his off field work was extremely valuable to the club. Both from the point that the Dogs list aged, and in his time at Richmond, it seemed apparent that he had a fundemental lack of attention on the defensive part of the game. He is a bit like a really good secondary teacher that is not much good at teaching basics to primary school kids.

To rank them, i would give them two categories (over simplistic as it may be). One for coaching a mature list, and one for coaching a ‘developing’ list.

Mature
=1st Lyon
=1st Wallace
3rd Ayres
N/A Bailey

Developing
1st Bailey
=2nd Ayres
=2nd Wallace
N/A Lyon

The N/As are because i have never seen them coach that kind of list.

What do you think Francesco?

‘As a Freo supporter I deplore the notion of relegation’ – Leigh Josie
Rest easy Leigh. The AFL has a relegation system in place. They (the AFL) call it relocation.

I think you are a bit harsh on those experienced coaches. Pagan took over a really bad playing list that was facing crippling draft sanctions (his decision to take the job was worse than any he made whilst at the club). The Essendon list that Sheedy left is performing well only a season and a half later, and his record of quickly bringing his club back to the top is far better than anyone else in the modern draft/salary cap era. Ayres has a solid coaching record in the AFL, is doing very well with Port Melbourne in the VFL, and he is still under 50.

The recent trend is towards young coaches, but only 3 of them have won premierships. Matthews as mentioned won 3 earlier this decade, and before him all the premierships dating back to 1991 went to coaches who were either older or who were on their second (or more) senior coaching job. I think a lot of experienced coaching talent is going to waste because of the current youth trend. I can’t think of another sport around the world where experience seems to be valued so lowly. The trend will continue for now though, which is reflected in my predictions.

However I do agree some of the points that you raise are very interesting.

As a Freo supporter I deplore the notion of relegation.

Matter of fact Scott, the last 5 GFs have been won by teams coached by the following (relatively) young coaches; Williams, Roos, Worsfold, Thompson, Clarkson (granted that the master Matthews had won the previous 3 GFs).

The real matter for discussion re AFL is how do we reduce the huge winning margins; how possibly can the AFL supply around another 90 AFL players (rookies lists included) to Surfers and West Sydney teams in the next 2 years. Will the next 2 new coaches of these teams succeed, if so, at whose expense? So do we in fact increase the failed coaches brigade from 8 to 10, seasonally (and nominally) adjusted?
Relegation system, anyone?