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	<title>Comments for The Stump</title>
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	<link>http://blogs.crikey.com.au/thestump</link>
	<description>The world of politics, policy and public life</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Sun, 22 Nov 2009 13:34:44 +1100</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>Comment on CPRS deal? by Julius</title>
		<link>http://blogs.crikey.com.au/thestump/2009/11/22/cprs-deal/#comment-1496</link>
		<dc:creator>Julius</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 22 Nov 2009 13:34:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.crikey.com.au/thestump/?p=1235#comment-1496</guid>
		<description>It is heavily odds on that the CPRS legislation will pass if only because of conscience votes (not unconnected to tenure) by Liberal Senators who are not Minchin&#039;s gang.

In fact Rudd will probably not try and ensure rejection because he can&#039;t be sure that he will actually get his double dissolution trigger and ability to fight a Liberal leader who is, if still Turnbull, hopelessly compromised.  So Turnbull will probably take Shadow Cabinet with him and present a pass-the-CPRS case to a party meeting where he will get the votes to pass the it with however small a fig leaf of government concessions, and the Minchinit conscience votes will not defeat the legislation.


Then Rudd&#039;s worst nightmare eventuates if the Business Spectator is right and the La Trobe valley generators have to be kept going by administrators put in by the banks.  Turnbull then has nothing to do but keep on scaring people witless about what Rudd and Wong have wrought and promise to put it right when elected.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It is heavily odds on that the CPRS legislation will pass if only because of conscience votes (not unconnected to tenure) by Liberal Senators who are not Minchin&#8217;s gang.</p>
<p>In fact Rudd will probably not try and ensure rejection because he can&#8217;t be sure that he will actually get his double dissolution trigger and ability to fight a Liberal leader who is, if still Turnbull, hopelessly compromised.  So Turnbull will probably take Shadow Cabinet with him and present a pass-the-CPRS case to a party meeting where he will get the votes to pass the it with however small a fig leaf of government concessions, and the Minchinit conscience votes will not defeat the legislation.</p>
<p>Then Rudd&#8217;s worst nightmare eventuates if the Business Spectator is right and the La Trobe valley generators have to be kept going by administrators put in by the banks.  Turnbull then has nothing to do but keep on scaring people witless about what Rudd and Wong have wrought and promise to put it right when elected.</p>
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		<title>Comment on CPRS deal? by Altakoi</title>
		<link>http://blogs.crikey.com.au/thestump/2009/11/22/cprs-deal/#comment-1495</link>
		<dc:creator>Altakoi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 22 Nov 2009 10:29:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.crikey.com.au/thestump/?p=1235#comment-1495</guid>
		<description>People have generally said that labour does not fear a double dissolution because they would certainly win. Perhaps, however, they are motivated to avoid a general election fought on the issue of climate change lest people actually make clear the mandate for change. They would hate to have to make explicit reductions promises to get re-elected, even if no politician actually takes election promises very seriously these days,.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>People have generally said that labour does not fear a double dissolution because they would certainly win. Perhaps, however, they are motivated to avoid a general election fought on the issue of climate change lest people actually make clear the mandate for change. They would hate to have to make explicit reductions promises to get re-elected, even if no politician actually takes election promises very seriously these days,.</p>
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		<title>Comment on CPRS deal? by AdamNeira</title>
		<link>http://blogs.crikey.com.au/thestump/2009/11/22/cprs-deal/#comment-1494</link>
		<dc:creator>AdamNeira</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 22 Nov 2009 08:57:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.crikey.com.au/thestump/?p=1235#comment-1494</guid>
		<description>In the photos from the time of the Stalinist purges in the early 1930&#039;s, the peasants can be seen walking willingly to the gallows. They are totally submissive, broken and compliant. On the gallows they smile meekly to the hangman and accept their fate.

In today&#039;s Australia there still remains some tough, resilient, questioning people who will not accept the dictates of certain experts. It will be interesting to see which groups submit and who will fight in the coming months and years.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In the photos from the time of the Stalinist purges in the early 1930&#8217;s, the peasants can be seen walking willingly to the gallows. They are totally submissive, broken and compliant. On the gallows they smile meekly to the hangman and accept their fate.</p>
<p>In today&#8217;s Australia there still remains some tough, resilient, questioning people who will not accept the dictates of certain experts. It will be interesting to see which groups submit and who will fight in the coming months and years.</p>
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		<title>Comment on CPRS deal? by Bogdanovist</title>
		<link>http://blogs.crikey.com.au/thestump/2009/11/22/cprs-deal/#comment-1493</link>
		<dc:creator>Bogdanovist</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 22 Nov 2009 08:49:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.crikey.com.au/thestump/?p=1235#comment-1493</guid>
		<description>I think the later scenario is about as likely as &#039;success&#039; at Copenhagen. What happens over the next week and what the political fallout will be will be interesting to watch, at least in terms of pollywatchers p0rn. Of course we&#039;ve long since abandoned hope that this process will make any difference to emissions.

What will be really interesting to see is how the climate lobby reacts over the next year or so. With either no scheme or a faux scheme locking in failure, and the likelyhood of stalled global negotiations, the pester power approach is looking shaky. The question is how far are climate activists willing to go?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think the later scenario is about as likely as &#8217;success&#8217; at Copenhagen. What happens over the next week and what the political fallout will be will be interesting to watch, at least in terms of pollywatchers p0rn. Of course we&#8217;ve long since abandoned hope that this process will make any difference to emissions.</p>
<p>What will be really interesting to see is how the climate lobby reacts over the next year or so. With either no scheme or a faux scheme locking in failure, and the likelyhood of stalled global negotiations, the pester power approach is looking shaky. The question is how far are climate activists willing to go?</p>
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		<title>Comment on Qld&#8217;s CMC, Police &amp; Palm Island by Andrew Bartlett</title>
		<link>http://blogs.crikey.com.au/thestump/2009/11/19/qlds-cmc-police-palm-island/#comment-1492</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrew Bartlett</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Nov 2009 14:09:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.crikey.com.au/thestump/?p=1221#comment-1492</guid>
		<description>&#039;Pedro&#039;

I never mentioned Hurley in this post.  This is not about his guilt or otherwise. It is about the unbelievable five year delay in investigating the mountain of evidence and allegations regarding the police &#039;investigation&#039; into the death in custody.

If you are so concerned about Mr Hurley, why wouldn&#039;t you welcome examinations of the police &#039;investigation&#039; of the death in custody?  Surely the more light shone onto it, the more it would show your view is correct? Unless you&#039;re just a miserable troll trying to smear anyone who dares to speak on behalf of the person who ended up dead with their liver cleaved in half as a result of a &#039;complicated fall&#039;. 

The five year (and counting) delay in examining the police &#039;investigation&#039; of the death in custody stands in stark contrast to  the overnight stormtrooper invasion of Palm Island in response to the disturbance following the almost instant initial &#039;finding&#039; that the death in custody was an accident.  

Are you seriously suggesting that there is no problem in taking more than five years to investigate these allegations?  Even if you don&#039;t give a toss about the residents of Palm Island, surely Mr Hurley deserves to have had this issue put to bed by now?

Of course if that&#039;s too hard to deal with, then by all means, go back to bashing up on Aboriginal people. That is much easier - and you will have history behind you to stoke your ego too.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8216;Pedro&#8217;</p>
<p>I never mentioned Hurley in this post.  This is not about his guilt or otherwise. It is about the unbelievable five year delay in investigating the mountain of evidence and allegations regarding the police &#8216;investigation&#8217; into the death in custody.</p>
<p>If you are so concerned about Mr Hurley, why wouldn&#8217;t you welcome examinations of the police &#8216;investigation&#8217; of the death in custody?  Surely the more light shone onto it, the more it would show your view is correct? Unless you&#8217;re just a miserable troll trying to smear anyone who dares to speak on behalf of the person who ended up dead with their liver cleaved in half as a result of a &#8216;complicated fall&#8217;. </p>
<p>The five year (and counting) delay in examining the police &#8216;investigation&#8217; of the death in custody stands in stark contrast to  the overnight stormtrooper invasion of Palm Island in response to the disturbance following the almost instant initial &#8216;finding&#8217; that the death in custody was an accident.  </p>
<p>Are you seriously suggesting that there is no problem in taking more than five years to investigate these allegations?  Even if you don&#8217;t give a toss about the residents of Palm Island, surely Mr Hurley deserves to have had this issue put to bed by now?</p>
<p>Of course if that&#8217;s too hard to deal with, then by all means, go back to bashing up on Aboriginal people. That is much easier &#8211; and you will have history behind you to stoke your ego too.</p>
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		<title>Comment on A good time to be reminded about the universality of the principle of compassion by Posts from elsewhere: More refugee mistreatment &#38; CPRS endgame</title>
		<link>http://blogs.crikey.com.au/thestump/2009/11/16/a-good-time-to-be-reminded-about-the-universality-of-the-principle-of-compassion/#comment-1491</link>
		<dc:creator>Posts from elsewhere: More refugee mistreatment &#38; CPRS endgame</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Nov 2009 10:52:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.crikey.com.au/thestump/?p=1202#comment-1491</guid>
		<description>[...] piece I wrote at Crikey about the release of a global Charter for Compassion, which has been launched after a year&#8217;s [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>...] piece I wrote at Crikey about the release of a global Charter for Compassion, which has been launched after a year&#8217;s [...</p></blockquote>
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		<title>Comment on Nastier refugee stand-offs in our region by shepherdmarilyn</title>
		<link>http://blogs.crikey.com.au/thestump/2009/11/20/nastier-refugee-stand-offs-in-our-region/#comment-1490</link>
		<dc:creator>shepherdmarilyn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Nov 2009 04:20:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.crikey.com.au/thestump/?p=1233#comment-1490</guid>
		<description>How many massacres and genocides have Indonesia committed over the last 40 odd years yet we still pander to them?

It&#039;s completely sickening.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>How many massacres and genocides have Indonesia committed over the last 40 odd years yet we still pander to them?</p>
<p>It&#8217;s completely sickening.</p>
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		<title>Comment on And then there&#8217;s Steve Fielding by BenE</title>
		<link>http://blogs.crikey.com.au/thestump/2009/11/16/and-then-theres-steve-fielding/#comment-1489</link>
		<dc:creator>BenE</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Nov 2009 04:10:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.crikey.com.au/thestump/?p=1186#comment-1489</guid>
		<description>So, someone you don&#039;t like or agree with politically admits to having been sexually abused, and you seize on the opportunity to heap criticism on them?

Unbelievable.

(EDIT)

Shame on you.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So, someone you don&#8217;t like or agree with politically admits to having been sexually abused, and you seize on the opportunity to heap criticism on them?</p>
<p>Unbelievable.</p>
<p>(EDIT)</p>
<p>Shame on you.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Nastier refugee stand-offs in our region by caf</title>
		<link>http://blogs.crikey.com.au/thestump/2009/11/20/nastier-refugee-stand-offs-in-our-region/#comment-1488</link>
		<dc:creator>caf</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Nov 2009 03:05:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.crikey.com.au/thestump/?p=1233#comment-1488</guid>
		<description>Australia has a long and proud history of &quot;&lt;i&gt;turning a blind eye to what other governments in our region are doing&lt;/i&gt;&quot;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Australia has a long and proud history of &#8220;<i>turning a blind eye to what other governments in our region are doing</i>&#8220;.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Qld&#8217;s CMC, Police &amp; Palm Island by Pedro</title>
		<link>http://blogs.crikey.com.au/thestump/2009/11/19/qlds-cmc-police-palm-island/#comment-1487</link>
		<dc:creator>Pedro</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Nov 2009 03:04:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.crikey.com.au/thestump/?p=1221#comment-1487</guid>
		<description>Nobody is happy with deaths in custody of aboriginals, but does that make Chris Hurley automatically guilty. No! It seems Mr Bartlett is not concerned with getting the truth - only with getting a policeman convicted, whether he be innocent or guilty.

How many inquests does there need to be. How many times does the hurt and the pain by both the relatives of Mulrunji Doomagee and Chris Hurley have to be revisited? Until Hurley is found guilty, judging by Bartlett&#039;s comments.

Anyone familiar with the case or Hurley’s background would be aware that Hurley (at least until what happened on Palm Island) was very protective of the aboriginal community. The fact that he asked to be located in this particular community - and was not just rotated there - speaks volumes. 

How many of you would or have volunteered to work in aboriginal communities. Not many I&#039;d say. 

That does not mean Hurley is a saint, only that it does not fit in with his character. A person who wanted to work with the aboriginals and had a clean record (to that point) would not suddenly go rampaging through the community because he suddenly found himself to be a racist.

What did actually happen that night is tough to tell, but it would appear Hurley&#039;s version would appear to be more correct. Anyone who has been in a scuffle knows that falling down often occurs, especially when dealing with a drunken person. Hurley landing on Doomagee with his knee is not just plausible, but likely. You only have to walk around a city at the weekend at night to see people who are fighting or being restrained falling to the ground and someone landing on top of them - it happens every weekend in most city’s.

Pre-conceived ideas of someone’s innocence or guilt are dangerous. Let it go Bartlett, for the sake of satisfying your own ego, it&#039;s not worth it. Let’s focus on the real issue, aboriginal health, housing, self esteem and their future.

Of course if that’s too hard to deal with, then by all means, go back to bashing up the police service. That is easier.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nobody is happy with deaths in custody of aboriginals, but does that make Chris Hurley automatically guilty. No! It seems Mr Bartlett is not concerned with getting the truth &#8211; only with getting a policeman convicted, whether he be innocent or guilty.</p>
<p>How many inquests does there need to be. How many times does the hurt and the pain by both the relatives of Mulrunji Doomagee and Chris Hurley have to be revisited? Until Hurley is found guilty, judging by Bartlett&#8217;s comments.</p>
<p>Anyone familiar with the case or Hurley’s background would be aware that Hurley (at least until what happened on Palm Island) was very protective of the aboriginal community. The fact that he asked to be located in this particular community &#8211; and was not just rotated there &#8211; speaks volumes. </p>
<p>How many of you would or have volunteered to work in aboriginal communities. Not many I&#8217;d say. </p>
<p>That does not mean Hurley is a saint, only that it does not fit in with his character. A person who wanted to work with the aboriginals and had a clean record (to that point) would not suddenly go rampaging through the community because he suddenly found himself to be a racist.</p>
<p>What did actually happen that night is tough to tell, but it would appear Hurley&#8217;s version would appear to be more correct. Anyone who has been in a scuffle knows that falling down often occurs, especially when dealing with a drunken person. Hurley landing on Doomagee with his knee is not just plausible, but likely. You only have to walk around a city at the weekend at night to see people who are fighting or being restrained falling to the ground and someone landing on top of them &#8211; it happens every weekend in most city’s.</p>
<p>Pre-conceived ideas of someone’s innocence or guilt are dangerous. Let it go Bartlett, for the sake of satisfying your own ego, it&#8217;s not worth it. Let’s focus on the real issue, aboriginal health, housing, self esteem and their future.</p>
<p>Of course if that’s too hard to deal with, then by all means, go back to bashing up the police service. That is easier.</p>
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